[rayiner]

Where would you move, and for what? The “wealthy and powerful” enjoy similar if not better corporate and investment tax rates in most of Western Europe as on the west coast of the US.

The social services those countries have that we don’t are largely paid for by the middle and upper middle class, not the “wealthy and powerful.”

[Retric]

Everywhere has problems, it’s less about perfection than simply being a better option. I’ve generally considered Canada the best option for a while. English speaking, low crime, same time zone with family, etc.

New Zealand, or one of the Nordic countries aren’t that far behind. Australia, England, and Western Europe etc are much lower, but still have plenty going for them.

The biggest thing America has going for it is my friends and family happen to live here.

[nradov]

Crime rates are a city by city and neighborhood by neighborhood issue. Most of the USA is very safe; my city has zero murders most years. The statistics are thrown off by a few neighborhoods in a few cities like Chicago that have degenerated into third-world war zones. While that's a terrible situation and we need to fix it, most HN users can easily avoid those places.

[Retric]

Even the “safe” parts of the US aren’t all that safe.

Ontario which includes Canada’s largest city and 38% of the population had a lower average murder rate between 2016 and 2020 than every single US state but New Hampshire. Quebec population 8.5 million is significantly lower.

These statistics aren’t completely equivalent due to various factors, but it’s close enough for reasonable comparisons.

[refurb]

You’re comparing a rate - murders over population, of a province with a vast rural population with few murders to US cities where murders are concentrated.

Edit: I'm an idiot and can't read.

[Retric]

I am comparing states with provinces.

The most populous “city” in Wyoming is Cheyenne with 63,957 people. Ontario meanwhile includes Toronto population City:2,794,356, Metro Area: 6,202,225.

Yet, your more likely to be murdered in Wyoming.

[reducesuffering]

If you want to talk cities, Toronto has a 2x - 3x higher per capita murder rate than my city in the US, so like GP said, it depends where you are. Sure you can generalize over a whole country, but ultimately what will matter is a city by city comparison where you actually are. And I'm safer here than Toronto.

[HWR_14]

Chicago's homicide rate isn't that high once you use per-capita numbers.

[mikewarot]

One day, on my way to work, there was a two hour backup, because the Eisenhower was closed for a murder investigation.

One day at work, making gears, I heard what sounded like fire-crackers... turns out there was a shooting in front of the gear factory. I had to drive through a murder crime scene to exit the parking lot.

Per capita numbers don't erase that from my memory.

[Retric]

Chicago and Toronto are roughly the same size, but per-capta Chicago has ~10x as many murders. That’s fucked up.

[HWR_14]

If they are per-capita then you don't need similarly sized cities. I was comparing Chicago's per capita numbers to the US's

[Retric]

Chicago’s per capita murder rate is much higher than the US.

In 2021 Chicago had 29.6 per 100k people where the US averaged 6.5 per 100k in 2020. The 4 least dangerous districts in Chicago are actually slightly below to the US’s average murder rate. https://www.judiciary.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/Ander%20testi...

The point of roughly equivalent sized cities is small entities can be much larger statistical outliers. A small city can go from a higher rate than Chicago one year to 0 the next year. Meanwhile Chicago’s numbers don’t really change with a single mass shooting etc.

[rayiner]

I'm not talking about what's perfect or not perfect. I'm talking about why OP thinks "the wealthy and powerful" are the reason for whatever shortcomings they perceive about the U.S.

Canada, for example, has basically the same corporate tax rates as the U.S. Canada's capital gains tax rate is effectively about the same as the U.S. for high income earners, because of only half of it is included in income. The social services are paid for by higher middle class taxes, including an 18% total VAT in Ontario.

[Retric]

US nominal tax rates are meaningless. Canada's companies pay twice the share of taxes as US companies.