[operatingthetan]

>No, it's run by a few humans.

Dang is employed by HN.

>That's not why reddit is different. It's because a lot of the humans that run the subreddits are inconsistent.

You're disagreeing and then saying something that isn't appreciably different.

[tptacek]

Dan is HN. The analogy to a subreddit is good; Dan has in fact much more control over HN than a moderator does of a subreddit.

[operatingthetan]

YC has a vested interest in keeping the HN moderation a certain way, it bring a certain quality to the discourse but it's different than the structure of any sub.

Dang has a direct relationship with the owners of the site and responsibility to them, that relationship doesn't exist in any way on reddit. The mods run amok.

Suggesting HN is effectively just another subreddit dismisses several important differences.

[tptacek]

No, I don't think that's how HN works at all. Dan can in fact run amok on HN. I don't believe there are significant pressures from YC on how Dan structures moderation here.

People unfamiliar with the setup here tend to think about YC first when they think about its management, but they should think about Dan first. My understanding is that things are pretty hands-off; even the perks that YC companies get here are, I believe, pretty much things Dan decided to give them.

[operatingthetan]

>Dan can in fact run amok on HN. I don't believe there are significant pressures from YC on how Dan structures moderation here.

I'm sorry but this is absurd. If dang had a mental break and decided only cat picture posts were allowed going forward, there would definitely be a conversation. It being hands-off so far means that YC and dang have current consensus and trust exists.

[tptacek]

The trust between YC and Dan regarding HN is probably the whole story about moderation here. Again: people think YC exerts a bunch of influence in how HN is moderated, and I doubt it exerts much influence at all. Dan is running this place the way he'd run it if YC didn't exist.

[operatingthetan]

I'm not sure why you're belaboring the point because whether it's trust or a contractual agreement to run the site a certain way the result is the same. Either way works for my argument which was that the relationship is the difference from reddit's way. I don't care how the relationship is mediated.

[searealist]

Then explain why yummyfajitas was banned. Pressure from above.

[mistermann]

> It being hands-off so far means that YC and dang have current consensus and trust exists.

But this is the very point of contention, and is not actually known.

[lmm]

The fact of being an HN employee means that Dan has a sword of Damocles above his head the whole time. Whether or not YC are actually calling him up day-to-day and telling him to do X or Y is irrelevant; he's smart enough to figure out what X and Y are and do them pre-emptively, and he knows his livelihood depends on it.

[operatingthetan]

Exactly, I'm so confused why people are speculating that dang is the only employee in the world not subject to a performance review. If someone is paying you, they have a stake in your work.

[tptacek]

No it doesn't. In fact, if I had to guess, the power dynamic probably goes the other way.

[numpad0]

Dang might be well-intended kind dictator, but he’s no machine. He’s just a very thoughtful and kind person with human limits and capacities.

[tough]

DanGPT won't have those limitations

[goatlover]

What about when DanGPT hallucinates a violation?

[TeMPOraL]

Email [e-mail] to report DanGPT is having a trip.

[OrvalWintermute]

Dang is a member of a specific community. Consequently, even if well intentioned, he is likely to share their cognitive biases and perspectives.

I think this is why we won't have great transparency around banning, shadowbanning, or a check on the censorious power of flagging.

[NotPractical]

I imagine that (thoughtfully) moderating a site as large as HN is no easy task, and though I'm all for more transparency, I think logs like that have the potential to open a whole can of worms and add much more burden on Dan. All of a sudden you get a bunch of HN posts that solely exist to criticize Dan's decisions which clog up the feed. If a rule is added against this it looks like even more censorship.

Lobsters [1] has mod logs, but it also has a much smaller community, and it's invite-only so there's less need for moderation in the first place.

[1] https://lobste.rs/moderations

[ilyt]

I don't think logs are needed in community moderated by single person, don't need logs to know who did what.

But for something like Reddit when there is more mods the anonymity basically means impunity to any judgement; nobody but mods themselves can say whether a certain bias in actions can be attributed to few mods or to everyone in the mod team.

And frankly if you can't handle a critique of your actions you shouldn't be moderating actions of others in the first place