[sojournerc]

Umm, northern Italy? Where do you think Rome is?

[triceratops]

Rome wasn't part of the HRE for a large part of its existence. The emperor was considered the continuation of the old Roman emperors, and was "holy" because the Pope crowned him.

I'm not an expert on Italian geography or anything but I think of Rome as the beginning of southern Italy. Milan and Turin are the major cities I associate with north Italy.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_in_the_Holy_Rom...

[rob74]

Most Romans would probably frown at you for debating whether Rome is in northern or southern Italy. Rome is at the center of the world, or failing that, at least at the center of Italy!

[triceratops]

Ok so then it's definitely not Northern Italy :-)

[TheCoelacanth]

Well, yes, as the old joke goes, the Holy Roman Empire wasn't holy, wasn't Roman and wasn't an Empire.

[piaste]

Voltaire made that joke in the late 18th century, when the dying HRE had been reduced to a multi-confessional German confederation.

The medieval HRE, especially the Carolingian one, had a much better claim to the titles.

[Bayart]

The Carolingian Empire isn't the HRE. The HRE started with the Ottonians.