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by burritas 1285 days ago
I really wish we could buy a new car these days without some insane infotainment system. I don't even want a screen or backup cam. I know DOT requires a backup cam, but they cause more trouble than they're worth and are there largely to compensate for the beefier pylons they also require now (less likely to get crushed if you roll, but more likely to get in an accident from reduced visibility).

I've owned or rented about four cars of different make and different software bases that would occasionally freeze up when you switch out of reverse into forward, but the cam would still be up, preventing you from accessing important car functions (and distracting the driver).

I've had to look up how to reset infotainment systems on youtube because it just wouldn't turn on at all.

There was also a report of an infotainment system which would glitch out if a radio broadcasted certain characters in their station or track info, causing it to stay stuck on that radio station, even across reboots (IIRC this was traced to an ancient js lib, I may be wrong though). How much help do you think the car manufacturer offered? It was likely asymptotic with 0.

But even if infotainment systems didn't suck for all these reasons, I still wouldn't want one. They seriously just suck ass by their very nature. Just give me a vehicle.

6 comments

> I don't even want a screen or backup cam.

Backup cams are mount lower and have a wider field of view than people do. They are really effective at keeping drivers from running over children. They are incredibly effective at this. Even in my low to the ground compact car, my backup cam sees things I cannot out my back window.

I wish I had it on while driving
Driving a car without a backup cam feels like being blind
That's because you really are blind. There is no way to see through or around the huge pillars on modern cars. Also with more modern cars being crossovers or SUVs, your height is also an impedance to rearward visibility.

Drive a car from the 80s and 90s with a big greenhouse. The vehicle brochures back then had visibility as a feature of the car. Car reviewers who cover retro cars talk about this a lot. They are always amazed at how much you can see out of older cars.

> The vehicle brochures back then had visibility as a feature of the car.

Visibility was a lot better, but little timmy on a tricycle was still hidden behind the rear trunk.

That said, the number of collision avoidance systems needed in modern cars to make up for the giant pillars has gotten out of hand.

Visibility from a tiny Renault Clio or Kia Picanto is just as shit as others. Stop fetishizing suv hate, it’s ridiculous.
I'm not concerned about COPS extracting data from my car, I'm MUCH more concerned about car's OEM extracting data regularly from remote from "my" car, who is mine just formally being connected to it's OEM and who knows what others.

This is a FAR BIGGER threat even in national security terms because an unpatched vulnerability might allow acting on ALL cars in a nation, for instance blocking them in some crucial intersections paralyzing the entire traffic, or push them to consume too much all at once (EVs/plug-in hybrid) from the grid to make mass blackouts and so on.

>but they cause more trouble than they're worth and are there largely to compensate for the beefier pylons they also require now

They're a decade late knee jerk reaction to the huge rear blind spots the Ford Expeditions and Chevy Suburbans that white collar types thought were the cool hot thing to own in 2004ish and characteristically refused to take responsibility for occasionally backing over their kids with them.

The fat pillars came a tad later with side curtain airbags.

> I really wish we could buy a new car these days without some insane infotainment system.

Oh man! I recently rented a car after a very long time; really loved CarPlay experience.

> I know DOT requires a backup cam,

This is interesting and not something I was aware of. Since when does DOT require that?

I don't agree that backup cameras are mandated (I may be missing some federal regulation, however). The regulations (that I've seen) provide a list rearward visibility tests that the vehicle must pass. There are no modern cars that can pass these tests without a backup camera, but I think that many sedans from the 1980s and maybe even the early 1990s could pass them without backup cameras.
I'm preparing to finally part ways with my long-suffering '94 Saturn wagon[0] and I cannot believe what we've given up in rear visibility in the last 30 years. Part of it is definitely safety (and I know how poorly my little wagon and I would fare in any crash) but I think another part of it is the high-belted, steeply sloping styling of newer cars. The Saturn has a tall greenhouse that stays tall all around with a low beltline[1], which looks irredeemably dorky compared to everything on the road today, but it's low enough to see a toddler running behind me while I'm preparing to back up. It makes me a little sad that I will probably never again have the opportunity to drive a car with visibility that good.

0: https://www.theautochannel.com/vehicles/new/reviews/wk9415.1...

1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturn_S_series#/media/File:1s...

As of May 2018.
Since 2018
You are in the minority of drivers. Most people want updated tech in their cars, including (what I consider to be) very valuable backup cameras. I'm shocked to see this sentiment about "dumb" vehicles rising on HN.
I don't think it's that shocking to see the sentiment. People who work with computers have (IMO) a better understanding of the pitfalls that can come with their integration into systems. We are more aware of the security issues that can arise, as well as the complexity they can introduce.

I don't agree with the backup camera take (I love mine), but I otherwise generally agree with the dumb car comment. I want my vehicle to be understandable and hackable, so I can work on it without needing access to its computer as much as possible. I don't want aspects of my vehicle to be made available on the public internet. I don't want a touch screen that eliminates tactile controls.

Most people I know just want carplay - or said another way, they want their car to cede control to their phone.