[strangeattractr]

There were people arrested for posts on Facebook during COVID lockdowns. We had police on the ground hassling every person in sight. Multiple friends of mine were fined for taking a momentary pause on their 1 hour of allotted outside time per day. Police were checking whether coffee cups were indeed full of liquid. We had statewide man hunts for people who sneezed in lifts that they were the only one in. Protests against the draconian measures were violently suppressed by the state government. It was one of the most important and impactful government decisions in the history of the country, affecting the lives of every person and dissenting political demonstration was banned.

The Federal government passed a law requiring a backdoor for all encrypted communication in the country and the press was completely silent. We ban drawn Japanese porn for some unknown reason while allowing real porn which unambiguously provides greater risk of harm. Prior to internet distribution of video games, many were simply banned for import on the whims of a parental advisory board. Australia is a nation obsessed with prohibition and there's nothing Australians love more than collective moral outrage followed by a cathartic wholesale ban.

I'm Australian and whenever I see valid criticism of the country on the internet I soon find an upset Australian replying. They never really refute the underlying point, they'll reply with a non-sequitur or talk about how it doesn't affect their lives. The reality is most Australians don't even feel the noose around their neck because they've never stepped out of line in any way. Most protections on liberty are for extreme and unusual circumstances, you don't notice their absence until it's too late. The vast majority of Chinese people trust their government, and believe the various restrictions on speech and liberty are in the best interests of the nation. Their curbs on liberty are too invasive of course, ours are necessary.

[throwawayxxcr]

We had statewide man hunts for people who sneezed in lifts that they were the only one in

Source?

[strangeattractr]

https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/health-wellbeing/covid-positi...

[Closi]

Lol, well that story is significantly different to a manhunt because someone sneezed in a lift.

It’s the story of someone who was sick and legally ordered to quarantine, breaking that quarantine which authorities then wanted to track down. He was spotted on CCTV in a lift.

You can argue the real story is ‘totalitarian’ too if you like, but that doesn’t make the original statement either false or at best a very misleading summary.

[strangeattractr]

Multiple police were out looking for him for days, they appealed to the public for info about his whereabouts. His face and name were plastered all over national media. I live in a different state and this guy was all anyone could talk about. People were desperate for him to be caught. If you saw this man, you were supposed to call the emergency services.

For context, I have never seen a murderer or armed robbery command this level of attention.

[Closi]

Yeah sure, but it’s different to what you claimed originally.

To use an example:

Person A: “I saw a person arrested for licking a lollipop!”

Person B: “That person had a communicable disease and was ordered by law to isolate. They weren’t arrested for licking the lollipop.”

Person A: “Well you don’t see murderers get the same level of attention as this lollipop guy! That’s all I’m saying!”

Regardless of how you feel about enforced quarantine, the person was not arrested for licking a lollipop.

[anakaine]

I've got to be honest here mate, your point of view is skewed.

This guy was being g tracked down because he was a quarantine dodger during a time when everyone was trying hard to contain the virus so it didn't break out and kill people.

The only banned Japanese porn is the kiddy stuff, but even then the law is around any kiddy porn stuff, filmed, animated, drawn, or otherwise.

The backdooring of security was discussed at large in the media, and to the best of anyone's knowledge hasn't even attempted to be implemented. This particular point is quite shit and we all should be up in arms about it, but Joe Average tunes out when it gets any more technical than their Ladbrokes multi on the weekend.

[strangeattractr]

> This guy was being g tracked down because he was a quarantine dodger during a time when everyone was trying hard to contain the virus so it didn't break out and kill people.

Are you capable of understanding nuance. Do you sincerely think my complaint is that a man was punished for breaking quarantine laws? My critique was of the sum total of the restrictions and the hysterical reaction of the public.

> The only banned Japanese porn is the kiddy stuff, but even then the law is around any kiddy porn stuff, filmed, animated, drawn, or otherwise.

Just simply false, all it requires is a google search [1]. The border force has blocked the import of any 18+ material from Japan. This ban probably affects less than a thousand Australians, but I included it to give people a taste of the Australian style of governance. Grant sweeping powers to enforcers and hope they don't abuse them.

> The backdooring of security was discussed at large in the media,

One particular bill in 2018 received attention, mostly from international media and orgs. This bill [1] passed last year and gave the AFP further ability to backdoor encryption as well as the power to modify your data and impersonate you. There were minor mentions prior to it being tabled. The day it was passed in parliament there wasn't an article about it on any major news provider. Most people are unaware this even happened.

> and to the best of anyone's knowledge hasn't even attempted to be implemented

Do you get much insight into what the AFP, ASIO and ASIS are working on usually? Yes, I'm sure that they make it public knowledge that they've implemented this. That wouldn't defeat the intended purpose at all. Can I clarify, they sought these powers just to have them they don't actually want to use them? And it's my viewpoint that's skewed?

[1] https://www.vice.com/en/article/xgz8md/japanese-hentai-is-no...

[2] https://www.homeaffairs.gov.au/about-us/our-portfolios/natio...

[throwawayxxcr]

He seems to have violated a quarantine order at a time when Covid was under control.

There are no countries in the world, including "bastions of freedom" that allow infectious public health risks to willfully violate quarantine,

BTW: one side-effect of the quarantine travel restrictions was that people overseas saw Australia as being in some sort of draconian lockdown, when, in fact, life was almost totally normal for most of the pandemic because of travel restrictions and qurantine (outside of Melbourne and parts of Sydney in 2021). And many Australians (especially those without overseas ties) assumed that life was "normal" for the rest of the world, when there was, in fact suffering and death, in addition to restrictions.

[strangeattractr]

Yes, the man appeared to have violated the law. I guess my criticism that the Australian government is overly restrictive and the public are hysterical moral busybodies has been rendered void because there was a law in place that he violated.

My friend was unable to go and see her dying mother in France because the Federal government wouldn't allow her to leave the country. Her request to leave was initially rejected and took so long that her mother was dead by the time she was given permission. Now I heard many people have similar experiences because of the inability to find flights. I didn't realise the government forbidding you to leave was a completely normal experience worldwide.

[fennecfoxy]

If she had travelled and gotten covid while travelling she could've easily passed it on to vulnerable people she'd bumped into and caused the untimely deaths of other peoples' loved ones.

We ALL had to make sacrifices during the pandemic.

[ThunderSizzle]

No. We did not.

Hindsight shows we were wrong and distracted on the wrong thing. Society doesn't care about flu this year, and it's hitting just as hard as covid was. Yet, all I see is messaging on Covid still.

[SV_BubbleTime]

I don’t know if you justifying the event with “well, he had Covid!” Is really defense you might’ve thought it was.

[throwawayxxcr]

Considering that life was normal for most of the country, the virus was contained until vaccines arrived, and the economy was booming, someone violating quarantine was a big deal.

[SV_BubbleTime]

I’m sorry, my satire detector was broken. Recalibrated it with and the economy was booming.

[_carbyau_]

> statewide man hunts for people who sneezed in lifts that they were the only one in

This is why we can't have a reasoned discussion. Use of hyperbole to replace actual good reasons.

"statewide manhunt" is actually more like a missing persons notice.

"sneezing" is actually having COVID.

"in lifts that they were the only one in" is actually leaving mandated quarantine to go spread COVID amongst a non-vaccinated society desperately trying to stop exactly that.

This is a glorified missing person's notice for someone who was being a dick. At the time, not many people were moving about and many had not much to do so yeah, a lot of people may have seen this news item in some form. But it wasn't a statewide manhunt.

EDIT: and instead of reasoned response. A downvote.

[rfd4sgmk8u]

The fact that you can't see such measures as being draconian is kinda the point of this thread. The way that the heavy handed nature of the Australian government approach seems normalized to your average Australian is precisely the normalization of authoritarianism being protested!

[_carbyau_]

... Not sure where in my post I comment on authoritarianism. I was criticising an absurdly skewed take compared to the source provided.

But sure. Lets go into this.

Part 1. Authoritarianism.

I don't like it. I do see the Australian government getting worse with it. And there is very little I could do to stop it other than vote right wing nutters out of parliament.

Part 2. heavy handed approach to COVID

I agree with it - even in hindsight. Society had no vaccine. No RAT. Awkward PCR testing process with delays. No real defense. The ONLY thing that we could do was to halt the spread until we could get a vaccine. As demonstrated by "elevator sneeze man", you can't trust the populace at large not to spread it.

And there were fuckups. Apart from "elevator sneeze man", the airport quarantine bungle anyone? These fuckups should be investigated in their own right.

But it largely worked.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

USA 100 526 312 cases, 1 105 029 deaths

Australia 10 651 218 cases, 16 119 deaths

Right now, Australia has ~10% of the number of cases as the US. Which is fair because we're roughly 10% the population size and now we're vaccinated COVID has been allowed to roam.

Australia has ~1.5% of the number of COVID deaths as the US. Which is down to being vaccinated BEFORE we let COVID roam.

I like my parents. I like the parents of many of my friends. At least some of them would have died due to COVID if it had been let to run rampant before we got a vaccine.

Conclusion

So yeah, I was happy to live through the Melbourne lockdown. As traumatic as it was, it was better than the alternative.

But ScoMo should be friggin' nailed for his "multiple ministries" bullshit.

[justinclift]

As a data point, I'm in Melbourne too and agree with your take on both parts. :)

[TapWaterBandit]

You can't seriously be saying this is just a right-wing problem. Dan Andrews literally shutdown playgrounds to stop children playing (sorry "their parents congregating").

A brutal streak of authoritarianism runs deep on both sides of Australian politics. They only get angry about who gets to hold the whip.

[throwawayxxcr]

Here's a summary of US states' quarantine and isolation statutes (since, to many Australians "freedom" means whatever the US does):

https://www.ncsl.org/research/health/state-quarantine-and-is...

Have a look at "freedom-loving" red states like Florida, Texas, Oklahoma, South Dakota, Mississippi, Georgia, Arkansas and Alabama. All seem to be quite "draconian" when it comes to quarantine

That eliminates the US. Maybe there's some other country that doesn't have "draconian" quarantine measures?

[strangeattractr]

I'm genuinely confused by your point. Are you saying that because other countries have quarantine restrictions, that makes their pandemic approach equivalently restrictive as Australia was? Victoria spent over 250 days in lockdown between March 2020 and October 2021. We had curfews at 6pm for weeks and were allowed out of the house for 1 hour a day and not beyond 5km of our houses. Are you seriously asserting that if the US enacted these restrictions, I would be on here professing that these were the pinnacle of freedom?

What I will remark is that US citizens have certain constitutional protections which we do not that in theory inhibit their government's ability to enact restrictions like these i.e. "freedom of movement".