[wonderwonder]

Of course its me that's offended by it, I don't think I was hiding it. With that said, I'm jewish, we've kind of had our own rough go of it. Good part of my family died in the holocaust and the Russian Pogroms. I had stones thrown at me as a child on 2 occasions because I was Jewish. In elementary school I had to sit outside in the open hallway rain or shine while the christian kids prayed (I'm not from America originally). I would never work for a company that singled Jews out beneficially and taught classes that said be polite to the Jews and don't discriminate against them. It means they are specifically saying I am different and that my coworkers are potentially anti-Semites. That's pretty awkward.

Desantis' stance is essentially telling teachers don't talk about Gay/Trans issues in the classroom and don't teach in such a way as to make children of a specific race feel bad or guilty for being of that race. You can argue it goes further than this and perhaps it does but that's my main takeaway and the reason for my vote. I'll still vote Biden for president though. I'm leaning towards voting Dem for federal positions and Republican on a state level.

[sure_about_that]

My kids are also Jewish, from my wife’s side. It is interesting to hear the comments of people when they have no idea.

Voting for split representation is a perfectly reasonable approach. I personally think DeSantis is pro-power, not pro-freedom. His stunt with asylum-seeking migrants is a great example. Also the fact that Florida doesn’t have things like legal weed, legal sports betting, legal abortion, and more.

[wonderwonder]

I for the most part agree with all your points on Desantis. Medical marijuana in Florida is a joke, I'm pro legalization. Not a fan of gambling personally but to each their own. On a personal level I think he's a Jerk. So with all that said as someone in my 40s that has only voted Democrat before, the fact that I am voting for Desantis shows how concerned I am with the social engineering going on in the country.

[sure_about_that]

I think DeSantis is the one engaging in social engineering, you just happen to agree with his policies. He is simply leaning into the culture wars which leads us to continued division without any actual solutions for the very real problems in our states/country.

I haven’t seen any evidence that being “anti-woke” improves K-9 test scores, lowers infant fatality rates, reduces mass shootings, improves quality of life, increases earnings, or any other actual benefit to citizens. It’s a distraction meant to prey on your emotions and hide the lack of actual policies.

[wonderwonder]

Maybe true, but I'm not looking for solutions to those things. Neither Democrats nor Republicans have solved them. California still has all the same issues. I specifically don't want to be treated as a racist in training by taking a million anti discrimination classes or be insulted by a class telling me to "sit in my shame". In addition I don't want schools to have the power to treat kids as different genders and not alert the parents. Nor do I want teachers to be able to promote transgenderism or homosexuality as a viable option for kids. If the child is gay or transgender on their own, so be it. School should not be the realm to promote it or suggest it.

[zzzeek]

> I specifically don't want to be treated as a racist in training by taking a million anti discrimination classes or be insulted by a class telling me to "sit in my shame".

it seems like this class your job had you take is a real source of trauma for you. While I think I know what someone would have meant by "sit in your shame" (they meant, if someone tells you something you said/did was offensive, just drop it, don't fight them on it), it's certainly not something you can expect white people who have never thought about any of this stuff to just nod their heads in agreement. it seems like the people doing the class are probably not well trained in how to do this kind of thing because if it leaves the students more hostile than when you started, that is likely counterproductive. But bigger picture, that you had a bad diversity class at your job is not the main issue as far as racism is concerned, it's the ongoing institutional racism itself that has a much more harmful effect on the actual victims. Like, someone told you to "sit in your shame", they didn't kneel on your neck until you were dead because they felt like it, or send you to prison for 12 years for filling out a form incorrectly. There's some proportionality to be considered here.

> In addition I don't want schools to have the power to treat kids as different genders and not alert the parents.

FOX News propaganda. this is not a thing

> Nor do I want teachers to be able to promote transgenderism or homosexuality as a viable option for kids.

transgenderism and homosexuality are not "options". you can't "decide" to be trans or gay. you are born that way. Surely, as someone who claims they have been a "liberal Democrat", you accept.... gay rights at least?

> School should not be the realm to promote it or suggest it.

FOX News propaganda. not a thing. Saying that "gay people exist" is not equivalent to "promoting it". If OTOH you think kids should be raised in complete ignorance that some people marry others of the same gender or wish to live their lives as other genders, then again, the "liberal Democrat" label really doesn't apply, that's a homophobic and bigoted opinion.

[wonderwonder]

I don't watch Fox news.

New Hampshire school district says it will not disclose to parents if their kids come out as trans at school and will lie to them if need be. https://thenationaldesk.com/news/americas-news-now/school-di...

California school plans how to mislead parents and scolds parents for using wrong pronouns https://kmph.com/amp/news/local/mom-scolds-california-school...

I could go on and on with these.

I'm pro gay marriage and want trans people to be able to transition if they want. What I have no interest in is anyone presenting either as an acceptable option to my kids. If they end up gay, so be it ill love them the same but no one should be putting those thoughts in their heads.

I'm white but also a jew, as I said in another comment, I have had stones thrown at me as a kid for it. I would never want my coworkers to have to take classes on anti semitism because it assumes they are potential anti semites. That is insulting. I have had calm informative conversations over beers with open anti semites, I'm fine. It did not bother me in the least because I'm not fragile. People are entitled to their opinions, right or wrong.

Every one is entitled to live their lives and raise their kids as they see fit barring some rigidly defined abuse. Parents not some teacher making 35k a year are the ultimate decider in kids lives; to push for anything else is insane and gives government and random people with teaching certificates an unholy amount of power. You seem to want to police people's minds and demand that every one adhere to your world view or they are terrible people. Most people just want to live their lives and be left alone. We don't care about movements or reparations for things we had nothing to do with. Raise your kids how you want and everyone else can do the same.

This is not Iran, we don't need a morality police. America is and will continue to be the greatest country on earth because of individual freedom and our at least historical ability to agree to disagree with each other.

[sure_about_that]

==California still has all the same issues.==

We weren't talking about California, the topic was Florida. That said, California's Governor is trying to solve those issues through policy, Florida's Governor is focused on being "anti-woke". Meanwhile, California has a Maternal Mortality Rate of 4/100k, Florida's is 22/100k [1]. One out of every 4,500 Florida women forced to carry a baby to term will die.

Interestingly, the 7 best states for K-12 education are all pretty "woke" [2]. Florida is ranked 33rd in math scores and 22nd in reading, maybe we should be looking to them for best practices rather than focusing one something completely unrelated to actually educating youth.

Edit to add: My state Illinois has much higher standard for students than Florida, which basically grades proficiency on a curve. Lowering the standards rather than the hard work of actually improving education.

"In Illinois, a student needs to earn a level of 4 or 5 to be considered proficient. In comparison, the rigor of Florida’s standards ranks 39th and 42nd, respectively, and a student only needs to earn a level 3 on the state assessment to be considered proficient." [3]

==treated as a racist in training by taking a million anti discrimination classes or be insulted by a class telling me to "sit in my shame".==

I've never had that feeling in a DEI class. I wonder why that is your reaction. It may be worth exploring why discussing equity makes you feel like you are losing something. Maybe you had a bad instructor?

==If the child is gay or transgender on their own, so be it. School should not be the realm to promote it or suggest it.==

This is the sex-ed argument all over again. If we don't mention underage sex, it doesn't exist. Talking about gay people doesn't turn someone gay. Banning books and regulating what teachers can teach/say doesn't seem like a solution to the problem you mentioned. It seems the same as mandating abstinence.

[1] https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/maternal-mo...

[2] https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/rankings/education/p...

[3] https://capitolfax.com/wp-mobile.php?p=55412&more=1

[wonderwonder]

Lol, I didn't have the feeling that it wanted me to "sit in my shame", it legitimately said it on a slide.

Again all valid points. My focus though is very self centered as a parent, it's on my kids and no one else.

My kids are A students and attend gifted classes, their schooling is fine. Regarding infant mortality, again you are probably right with the numbers but they are not my focus. All of these things were my focus for a very long time, don't forget I have been a hard core Dem for 20+ years. My concern now is my kids and what I want them exposed to at school. I have been pretty focused on doing the greater good politically for a long time. In regards to the current upcoming state elections I am going to be selfish and focus only on what is best for my family for the next 4 years.

Note: I am also very aware that my change in focus and world view is significantly linked to my high income and the benefits it provides me right now. I just am fine with it, and am putting my goals and wants for my family over everything else. I worked 50-60 hours a week for years to get here. I'm not opposed to being selfish for a bit.

[LawTalkingGuy]

> This is the sex-ed argument all over again. If we don't mention underage sex, it doesn't exist. Talking about gay people doesn't turn someone gay.

Democrats nicknamed it the "don't say gay" bill but that isn't its name, its goal, or its outcome. It's about the age appropriateness of the introduction to the topic.

The issue, to the parents who campaigned for the bill and the politicians who passed it, is gender. Unlike homosexuality (LGB), talking about gender does turn people transgender - or rather has the school hook the child up with hormones and body modification without the parent's knowledge.

Just fyi, about the news renaming and reframing things before you hear about them, Florida republicans protected women's sex-based rights by making male-bodied people play sports on men's teams and the news called it "denying transgirls their human rights to play sports".

> [To WonderWonder] Did you feel shame? If I was told that, and didn't feel shame, not sure I would have dwelled on it so much.

WonderWonder is thinking of their children, and how they'll be told they're racist - and to sit in their shame - just because of their race. That's a pretty regressive outcome so I understand them wanting to avoid it.