[pilgrimfff]

> iFixit praises the M1 MacBook Air service manuals by saying “they’re in-depth, mostly logical, and well worth an additional repairability point,”

This is the service manual you're referencing. The one they're complaining about it is the M1 MacBook Pro.

Here's the actual manual referenced: https://manuals.info.apple.com/MANUALS/2000/MA2085/en_US/mac...

And here's iFixIt's actual complaint:

> it’s not 162 pages because Apple has changed where batteries sit in the MacBook Pro. It’s that long because the manual says that to replace the battery, you’ve got to replace the entire top case. At the time of writing, Apple will not sell you a replacement MacBook Pro battery. They sell you a “Top Case with Battery and Keyboard.”

[Spooky23]

Modern flat lithium batteries are fairly hazardous and Apple is very conservative in their approach to handing them.

They never want a Samsung like situation where the airport announcer says “No MacBook Pro 14” on the plane”. Additionally, because it’s Apple, there would be a media shitstorm if that happened.

[meragrin_]

They'll sell you just a "modern flat lithium battery" for one model but not another. It isn't about the hazardousness of the batteries.

[bioemerl]

The Samsung situation was because they shipped batteries that exploded without being modified in any way. I don't think that's a fair comparison.

[vimy]

It’s always been like that. Bring your macbook to an Apple store for a battery replacement and they will replace the top case.

[avisser]

I purchased a battery (just a battery) for my 2013 MBP. It was a pain to replace, but I replaced it with the help of an iFixIt guide.

I believe it's that kind of guide people expected Apple to publish.

So you may be right that it's always been Apple's policy, but the point was that the self-repair program is falling short of expectations. iFixIt set a standard and Apple has fallen short.

[tpmoney]

Why would anyone expect the self service process setup by Apple to be anything other than the same processes they have for their own repair people though? I don’t expect a car manufacturer to release parts and instructions they wouldn’t have their own service people follow. It’s reasonable to debate the merits of having the battery tied to the top case on the whole, but if it’s what Apple directs their own repair personnel to do, that’s what I would expect their self service to do too.

[the_third_wave]

A car manufacturer which claimed you needed to replace the whole front end of the car to replace the battery would be ridiculed by everyone and soon be out of business. The fact that those batteries are glued down is not a valid reason to replace the whole top as is shown by the multitude of mobile devices with glued-down batteries which can be replaced without problems. They either have some strip you can pull to loosen the battery or a set of instructions on where to push a thin piece of plastic underneath the battery to lift it. Apple can do this as well but they don't want to

[tpmoney]

You’re probably in for a nasty surprise when you look up the process for replacing the battery pack in an EV, which is a more apt comparison than the standard hunk of lead and acid in an ICE car. Just like Apples laptops, EVs are trying to cram batteries into every possible space to maximize capacity, meaning that replacement will involve some substantial disassembly.

And yes, Apple can do it and has even said they’re going to do it. So at this point, it’s just a matter of guessing for why they don’t do it now. And that could be any number of reasons, including easier manufacturing or in a surprise twist maybe easier repair. Look at the ifixit instructions and look at the spacing available to access the pull tabs for the adhesive around the various frame parts. It’s entirely reasonable to think that Apple did some math on battery repair frequency; on that fact that even when an M* systems battery is at the 80% mark where it’s eligible for repair that it will still be near or over 100% of the old intel laptop runtimes when new; evaluated the chances of those adhesive tabs breaking or having the battery or top case damaged while removing one or the other and decided that bundling the two together and eating the cost on battery repairs was the easier option for their repair people. Because ultimately Apple’s priorities likely are ease of manufacture first, ease of store based repair second and ease of user based repair third. Because even with really easy user based repair, I would venture to say close to 90% of people will still have Apple do it for $200. And I say that based both on the fact that Apple used to offer various DIY repair options for older models* and people have their mechanic or AutoZone replace their car batteries for them even though that’s literally just 2 bolts.

* I worked for an Apple authorized repair place in the G5 iMac days, in which for example the power supply was “user replaceable” and for which Apple offered customers DIY repair options on them. I can count on one hand, with fingers to spare, the number of customers who took us up on the option to order the part and do it themselves, even if having us do it meant longer turn around times. On the whole people don’t DIY repairs for things, and so engineering and manufacturing for that use case is probably a worse decision than engineering and designing for your own people and while those people might benefit from DIY friendly features, if that makes manufacture harder or more expensive, then that’s still likely a net negative trade off.

[the_third_wave]

No, the EV pack is not an apt comparison, the battery packs in e.g. those Thinkpads I have around here are. One of them (a T550) has an internal battery pack in addition to the easily replaceable one. It can still be replaced easily after removing the (clearly marked) screws and removing the pack.

As to your experience working for an Apple authorised repair centre I'd suggest that the intersection between Apple users and DIYers is probably smaller than that between e.g. Thinkpad users and DIYers. Part of the appeal of the Apple world lies in its appliance-like nature where things (are supposed to) 'just work', not in its openness to tinkering.

As an aside I must say I'm surprised in the fervour with which these Apple strategies are defended. It is not hard to design a glued-down battery which can be removed by pulling a few tabs as is common in many mobile devices, why defend this clearly wasteful practice? Maybe Apple keyboards are (or were, at least during the 'butterfly keyboard' years - 2015-2019) close to being shot around the time the battery wears out but even so it would be easy to make that keyboard replaceable.

[jagger27]

Well, it wasn’t _always_ like this. Apple used to have unibody MacBooks with user replaceable batteries without even needing a screw driver.

[olliej]

The laptops were also bigger, heavier, and had less battery life. Everything is trade offs.

The https://everymac.com/systems/apple/macbook_pro/macbook-pro-u...: 2008 15" unibody [last one that didn't need at a least a screwdriver] 1" thick, 5.4lbs, 5 hours of browsing

https://www.tomsguide.com/reviews/macbook-pro-m1:M1 MacBook Pro, 0.625" thick, 3.5 lbs, 16 hours of browsing.

Obviously technology has improved (there's a 6 hour increase in battery life going from last intel laptop to an m1), but it also probably helps that that smaller light modern MacBook has a 100 watt hour battery, while the one you're referring to had a 45WHr battery.

[vimy]

You're right. It started with the 2016 redesign. The reason is that the battery is glued to the case. Trying to remove it is dangerous.

[overgard]

They're glued in the 2013 retina models also (I know -- I've replaced the battery twice). To do it "properly" you pretty much have to take apart the entire thing, remove the logic board, etc., although if you're willing to cut corners you can sneak it out without too much fuss. In theory you can use a light amount of acetone to loosen the glue, but that always made me incredibly nervous so I just prodded it with a plastic spudger until I could get it free.

I would gladly trade a fancy unibody for a battery that's easily replaceable :-/

[rainbowzootsuit]

It's similar to the "Replace Engine Soon" light in a BMW.

[dkonofalski]

So it's a temporary situation to do it this way until they can get enough stock and work their supply chain to provide additional batteries? What a non-story.

[wlesieutre]

I don't see anything to suggest that this policy will change in the future, they probably don't want to risk someone burning their house down while trying to remove a glued in pouch battery and then blaming Apple for it.

Incidentally on the flip side of this, I got a free new battery out of the keyboard replacement program because they replace this whole top case assembly for keyboard replacements as well.

I hoped that whole keyboard warranty extension fiasco would encourage Apple to stop gluing everything together so much and design for individual components to be replaced again, but I guess not.

[ezfe]

They do say on the website they're planning on selling the batteries individually in the future.

[wlesieutre]

Whoops, so they do. That's a repair I wouldn't want to touch by myself but good luck to anybody who does!

The last Mac laptop I did repairs on was a snapped hinge and man that a painful process. Similar boat with having to take the entire computer apart (including the screen assembly). These days I'd be much happier to pay someone to deal with that, but doing it yourself is certainly the affordable solution and I'm glad that self repair continues to be an option.

[tomxor]

It doesn't have to be hard if they design it reasonably. XPS is similarly "thin" and you only have to undo 4 screws to replace the battery.

[robmccoll]

I replaced the glued-down baggie-cell batteries in the laptop I'm currently using. It was a giant PITA, and I was very wary of burning my house down the entire time. It would absolutely be worth the cost difference to secure and protect the batteries in any other way.

[chris_wot]

They sell the top case and battery already. What supply chain issues are you referring to?

[smoldesu]

What's your source for Apple planning to provide individual batteries?

[dkonofalski]

I know that you're a weird anti-Apple contrarian but it literally says this in the article that we're discussing here.