[khy]

I had a car that had a single physical input: a dial that you could press. The dial would move the focus around the screen, and you'd press the dial to click. This was, in my opinion, a far superior experience than regular touch screens, and it probably doesn't suffer from the problem you're describing.

[SomeBoolshit]

For use cases where you don't want to look away from the main task you're performing, it's definitely better than a regular touchscreen.

You don't have to aim your finger at anything, you just have to scroll and check whether you're there, yet.

And you'll start remembering how many notches you have to scroll to reach the functions you need, becoming less dependent on the screen at all.

The difficulty is in balancing the number and arrangement of submenus and the buttons/menu entries triggering whatever function, although the same issue exists with regular touchscreens.

[ghostpepper]

I'm starting to feel like I'm shilling for Mazda but this is exactly how the touchscreen control works in all their new cars.

Physical dials and buttons for all the important controls for, y'know, driving the car - but for stuff like interacting with maps, streaming music and all the other CarPlay/Android Auto apps - what you've described is exactly what they have, and I got used to it very quickly. Even though the touchscreen works at low speed, I never use it.

I'm sure there are other manufacturers who have resisted the urge to copy Tesla's omni-screen and I'd love to know who they are.

[Tagbert]

No but it converts the action into a multi-step process. A button is a single-step process. Multi-step is fine for infrequent configuration-type actions that happen when you are not actively driving but are a distraction while driving.

[jdvh]

It’s also a multistep process with a touch screen: 1) find the button on the screen 2) lean over to reach it 3) touch it and look at it while doing so to confirm you did it right.

In a clickwheel car the wheel moves the focus rect. You twist it blindly to approximately the right spot. Then you look at the screen and adjust one or two clicks and press to confirm. You won’t trigger the wrong action by accident and the focus rect makes the operation async: you don’t have to look while you turn the wheel, you can look at the screen when it suits you.

[banannaise]

Audi used this through around 2018. It's wonderful. Absolutely superior to a touchscreen. It's very hard to precisely touch a screen at the distance and angle typical of a car touchscreen (and even harder if you're actually driving the car). Wheel-and-button means more scrolling through options, but zero accidental inputs, and you don't need to focus on the precision of your inputs.

It's a bad interface for everything but a car screen, and an unquestionably superior one for a car screen.

[ChrisMarshallNY]

> The dial would move the focus around the screen

That sounds dangerous. It's basically the interface that AppleTV uses.

I find it extremely confusing, as I frequently select the wrong item (and I have been using AppleTVs for years).

Also, it's no fun to program.

[falcolas]

AppleTV remotes have a problem where they're too sensitive. You almost can't click without entering a "move left/right" touch command. In many ways, Apple has found a way to get the worst of both worlds by trying to incorporate both worlds into one touchpad (yes, even in the newest remotes).

[ChrisMarshallNY]

I agree. The newest remote is a big improvement, but I find the touchpad to be all but worthless (I assume it is useful for games, which I never play on the TV).

I wish there was a way to disable the directional part of the touchpad.

[someguy5344523]

Really? That sounds like the worst of both worlds to me; you still have to look at the screen to see what you're selecting, but you also can't just click the thing you want directly.

[falcolas]

> you still have to look at the screen to see what you're selecting

Asynchronously, yes. And since there's physical feedback (detents in the turning), you can do it by feel eventually.

> you also can't just click the thing you want directly.

If it's off screen, you still have to do some kind of scrolling, and hope you don't inadvertently select something while trying to scroll. I do this ALL THE TIME with the touch screen I have.

[hedora]

The jog dial is great. I don't have to watch my finger find the right thing to press on the screen. This more than halves the time I spend looking at the screen.

Also, our car (BMW i3) has 8 programmable buttons (like old-school radio presets) that let me jump around in the user interface to frequently used screens.

Some niche things I use frequently (check my email for new GPS destinations, bypass FM auto-tuner, and advanced energy efficiency monitors) are buried two or three menus deep, so I created shortcuts for them. I use buttons 1, 3 and 8 all the time.

I use the jog dial more frequently than the shortcuts though. The menus provide fast access to more commonly used stuff (pair bluetooth, choose podcast / artist / album, control GPS zoom and routes, turn off screen). You can skip audio tracks and initiate phone calls to people in your phone book with dedicated buttons and a thumb dial on the steering wheel.

There are dedicated buttons and knobs for climate, and eco drivetrain modes.

[mulmen]

Does it still have a touchscreen? My 2010 BMW has iDrive which works great for almost everything. It only falls down with text entry because I have to scroll through the alphabet. It does do predictive entry so I don't have to type the whole address but it is the one time a full keyboard would be nice and even I admit that's too much in a car.

[ak217]

The key is to design the menus in such a way that it's easy to memorize (long press to pop up to the top menu, scroll all the way to the right, back two clicks left, press to get into the climate control menu, etc.) The power of this approach is amplified when the controls are thoughtfully designed with precise tactile feedback and multiple dimensions of interaction (e.g. two dials or a dial surrounded by multi-function buttons) and the menus are designed to take advantage of those dimensions.

[ricardobeat]

The BMW i* line is like this, and although it works alright, it's a terribly clunky experience when you're actually driving, even more distracting than a touchscreen.

[dqft]

And you can't even use it when the car is moving above 10mph.. I have the same system in my Lexus.

[hedora]

I don't have any of these problems with the jog dial on my BMW i3. I can use it at any speed, and it is much less distracting than all the touchscreens I've used from a half-dozen manufacturers.

Sadly, BMW seems to be switching to android auto. Having a jog dial is about as important as the overall vehicle form factor, being an EV and safety. Hopefully, they'll become more popular over time.

[heleninboodler]

BMW's i-drive interface is OK but it's not great. What I definitely do appreciate about BMWs, however, is that they provide some dedicated hardware controls, e.g. the volume knob. I also like the fact that they seem to be dedicated to the idea of making most everything doable with the shuttle puck thingy, which lets you sit in a comfortable driving position while going through menus and only glancing off the road briefly.

My main gripe with touch screens is not that you have to look at it at all, it's that you have to keep looking at it while you're touching it. With the shuttle control, you can glance over to see that the focus is on the right item, then look back at the road while you click it. Hitting a button on a touchscreen at arm's length while driving a vehicle over even minor bumps is basically impossible without looking. And in most cars, you have to slightly lean forward as well. Aiming error is introduced all the way from your upper back through your shoulders, arm, and fingertip. It's absolutely ludicrous that some car manufacturers don't see this.

[dmead]

cars that support android auto try to do this. theres a button on the steering wheel that turns on the voice assistant like a phone. you can do a lot an definitely not take your eyes off the road.

[bluedays]

I had an ipod once.