[nlnn]

Obviously it's not quite the same thing, but reminds me of an old neighbour we had.

She used to love baking, and would bring round cakes/pastries/bread for us all the time.

It was really nice at first, but also made us feel very awkward/bad that we didn't reciprocate (neither of us really cook much), even though we'd never asked for the cakes.

Eventually we had to ask her to stop, since we just didn't want to eat that much unhealthy food. She took it as a bit of an insult, and ended up being a lot colder to us after that.

It was a shame, but I'm not sure what else we could have done - she was giving us something unasked for (which we felt burdened by, even though she said she never expected anything in return), and got upset when we asked her to stop.

[mempko]

Debts are what bind neighbors and communities together. You felt bad because you were in debt to her giving but didn't want to have a relationship with that person by reciprocating. Often, the worst thing you can do in relationships is to get out of debt. Debts are a reason for people to see each other. By telling that person to 'stop baking', you told them essentially 'i don't want to have a relationship with you'. (see Debt, the first 500 years by David Graeber)

[mikepurvis]

Great book. Another good one is Sacred Economics by Charles Eisenstein, which covers some of the same ground, in terms of understanding the dynamics that tie together people and communities, ensuring fairness and an appropriate level of redistribution, but with needing a formal money system or taxation. (Potlatching, for example...)

[nlnn]

Looking back at it, I have plenty of good relationships that don't involve debts, maybe because I've avoided any that did.

I've always been very uncomfortable about being in debt to anyone for anything unasked for, that just seems manipulative to me.

I've not read David Graber's book though, added to my (evergrowing...) reading list, thanks.

[newshorts]

I learned about this from my mom. She’s a giver, but to the point where we don’t want the stuff.

We appreciated the thought, but she would bring so many toys for our daughter it was overwhelming and we didn’t Have that much space.

It was clearly more for my mom than for us, she just likes to give.

So I reciprocated by saying thanks and promptly throwing/donating something older. This allowed my mom to keep giving and us to not have the clutter.

I’m glad to confirm what I already knew by your story. It would have hurt her and damaged our relationship if I would have asked her to stop.

[gsinclair]

My mother likes to give cheap things found in op shops. Definitely more about her than the recipient: the satisfaction of a bargain and seeing things be continued to be used. I think it’s also a subtle way to try to control others’ spending because … hey, you don’t need a new X anymore.

Anyway, after seeing the relationship futility of resisting the unwanted gifts too persistently, I now just give some approximation of a warm thank-you, then donate the items to a charity shop.

Cycle of life.

[jollyllama]

The baking thing is real. People think they're helping you by loading you down with carbs and sugar. It's like someone buying you drinks - no, asking you to drink another round of his homebrewed beer - when you've already had enough. Upon reflection here, I think the best thing to do is probably to say "great, I'll eat this later" and feed it to the wild beasts.

[itsthejb]

This is called a “covert contract”. It’s perhaps the key part of “nice” behaviour that is everything but - you can’t tie someone up in a “deal” that they never agreed to. Even worse, punishing someone else for not keeping up their side of the non-negotiated “deal”