[morpheuskafka]

How is it allowed for a dealer to cut wires and install a non OEM-approved electronic device onto the CAN bus? This seems like it would void all the manufacturer warranties and potentially create liability for the manufacturer if it malfunctions.

[userbinator]

This seems like it would void all the manufacturer warranties

That's what the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnuson%E2%80%93Moss_Warranty... is for.

[BoorishBears]

Not really...

This is a complete hack job and I doubt there is a single component related to the electrical system that wouldn't be an easy denial from Honda unless the dealer played along... and in a modern car so much is tied to the electrical system that, while technically they didn't just void their entire warranty, they did just gut it to the point of being nearly useless.

[hedora]

When we bought a brand new GMC, Dealer A installed a counterfeit backup camera.

Half a tank of gas later, Dealer B claimed the warranty was void because of the camera. We brought it in because the radio kept freaking out and it would drain the battery if left off over night.

There was an active recall for both those issues. Dealer C fixed them by installing a firmware update.

[api]

Has anyone ever had an actual good experience with an auto dealer?

[sgtnoodle]

Our certified pre-owned GMC Acadia spent two months in the dealership. They needed a special tool to fix an emissions issue. GM said it would take 6 months to get the tool, so the dealership ordered one on eBay. They gave us a rental car the whole time, and even swapped it out for a premium trimmed GMC Terrain when we went on a family road trip.

The dealership had previously repaired the moon roof, and inadvertently damaged the headliner. So, while working on the emissions issue they replaced the whole headliner. The replacement is a little cheesier than from the factory, but good enough.

There's still an exterior rattle that they claimed they fixed 3 times now. At least they're trying. Last time I took it in, they removed several trim pieces and drove it around. I'm just going to have to track it down myself I guess.

I bought a new Mustang in 2010, and paid for the 5 year extended service plan. The hood paint corroded and the dealership repainted it, and gave me a rental car for the week. The hood has since corroded again and it's out of warranty now. I am mulling over splurging on a new paint job, with a classic Mustang racing stripe.

Buying the Mustang, I went to three dealerships. The first one, I got a test drive, and then the salesmen just walked away. I think he assumed I wasn't serious when I said I was buying a car that day. The second dealership, the salesman was super sleazy and pushy, and so I walked away. The third dealership, the salesman was really relaxed and professional. He asked if I was financing, and when I said no, he said he didn't like to waste time haggling and was happy just to move inventory. He offered me a price just $200 above the friends-and-family x-code price.

[temp_praneshp]

We got a car two weeks ago, the experience at the Acura dealership was pretty good (of course, we got presented the bullshit warranty stuff in the finance manager's room, but we were able to turn everything down for a couple of minutes and things were ok).

We also had a good time at a Toyota dealership, but any car buying with them had a $6290 markup....

[devoutsalsa]

Next time try generating the sales documentation using markdown.

[temp_praneshp]

Re. markdown, why should I? Also, what's sales documentation, is that something I should have received?

Given the state of the market, choosing between many cars wasn't an option, but outside of that, I care that the process is fast, there aren't sneaky charges, and the interaction is respectful. I prefer all my paperwork printed out, and that's what they did by default.

[thr0w__4w4y]

Whhooossh moment. You said there was a $6K /markup/, parent was making a joke about /markdown/.

[judge2020]

Manufacturers must prove a modification to a car caused the fault in a product to deny an otherwise-covered warranty issue, regardless of who installed it. As for if this device kills the battery or what-have-you, i'm not sure what sort of liability the dealership is taking.

[themulticaster]

Does this apply even if the manufacturer adds a clause like "any modification not authorized by [manufacturer] or performed by a [manufacturer]-approved repair shop voids the warranty"?

[judge2020]

It doesn’t matter what the manufacturer says, they cant void the entire car’s warranty due to a modification. If a 3p repair shop performs eg. a brake pad replacement and then your brakes fail, then that repair shop is liable and not the manufacturer.

[NonNefarious]

The law isn't limited to cars.

[franga2000]

It is in practice. Rooting a smartphone? Overclocking your CPU? Replacing parts in a laptop?

[hedora]

All of those things are protected. If the firmware melts the board, the CPU overheats, or the replacement part shorts something out then the warranty is void. However, if the failures are unrelated, then it's fine.

I once caught a motherboard on fire, then found some unrelated mechanical issues with it. (It still worked, except for the bad connector.)

The burn marks were cosmetic, and the shop sent me a DOA replacement. (That's more a story about the shop being awesome, but they were technically legally obligated to honor the warranty.)

[gambiting]

Replacing parts in a laptop absolutely does not void your warranty no matter what the manufacturer says.

[franga2000]

What do you mean "no matter what the manufacturer says"? If the manufacturer says your warranty is void - it is. If they broke a law in doing so is a separate issue that you would have to battle out in court.

When your 800$ laptop's speakers start buzzing and the service center says you need to pay 80$ for the repair because the tamper seal on the RAM was broken, are you really going to spend 30k and a year of your free time to sue them over it?

[hedora]

If you can get the big company to say they're denying the warranty for that reason in writing, you could probably find a no-win, no-pay lawyer to file an eight digit class action lawsuit.

They know that as well as you do. I've found they usually do more passive aggressive / ambiguous stuff than overtly break the law.

Once we had a Toshiba laptop with a bad motherboard. They replaced it with some other board that didn't have drivers for Linux, or even for Windows.

Lenovo took over thirty days to repair my IBM thinkpad (broken screen connector), and when it came back, the high voltage screen transformer was shorted to the case, so it shocked the heck out of me when I turned it on.

On top of that, they didn't replace the broken screen connector, and claimed it was "no fault". This was after the local lenovo repair people found the fault, and lenovo said they couldn't ship the required part.

[gambiting]

>>are you really going to spend 30k and a year of your free time

Are there no small claims courts where you live? Ombudmans? It really isn't a huge deal, nor is it very expensive. It's not 30k - more like $50. And not a year, usually few weeks at most.

>>? If the manufacturer says your warranty is void - it is.

No, it isn't, that's the whole point.

[nopenopenopeno]

The relevant context is, though.

[AH4oFVbPT4f8]

Because they didn’t think they would get caught