[k_sze]

One could be “happy”* for a friend and also feel shitty about themself.

“Damn. Matthew has changed jobs 3 times in the past 5 years already, each time to a better paying job. Look at you. You’re still stuck in this shitty job because you suck.”

This is literally the kind of thought I have had in the past.

[*] Are you “happy” in a polite way? Or are you genuinely happy?

[laputan_machine]

Genuinely happy, of course! I want to see my friends and family succeed in life and enjoy it. I don't feel like a lesser person in any way, I feel proud of them.

[johnnymorgan]

You've never felt Envy towards someone?

I kind of find that hard to believe.

that was all OP was referring too and it's well documented. Honestly you come off as dishonest in this convo as it's quiet a normal emotion to feel and it's not negative per say, it can lead to negative actions but can also push people to do better.

"It doesn't matter if the slight is real or not, its the perception of the person that matters" -- Jimmy Hoffa

[laputan_machine]

I've never felt envy towards my friends and family. No, never. I find it bizarre that you do.

I never said I don't feel envy. You jumped to conclusions based on a very little sentence I wrote.

I currently have a very severe skin condition, and I live in a country with 'free' healthcare. I am envious that some people get medical treatment for it and can live a normal life again and some people do not (such as myself).

I don't give a shit if you think I'm dishonest, you do not know me.

[sdevonoes]

> I find it bizarre that you do.

Why? Feeling envious is just human nature. Sure, one can argue that in our current society that kind of feeling is "bad", and we should "fix it". I tend to agree, but that you find it bizarre, it's bizarre to me :D

Oh well, maybe you are a machine (based on your nickname), so yeah, machines do not have imperfections (just kidding).

[id]

It's definitely not "human nature" to feel envy towards your friends and family, unless you have been wronged by them.

[k_sze]

> It's definitely not "human nature" to feel envy towards your friends and family.

Let me tell you how I had envied my cousin when he had a Super Famicom (a.k.a. SNES in North America) with a stash of great games and I didn't (not even the base machine), when I was a kid. He never wronged me. In fact, we were really good buddies when we lived next to each other more than 20 years ago, but I still envied.

[johnnymorgan]

It's so well documented it's even a legit part of the Bible kekw

I guess you're a saint and the rest of us are just dirty sinners haha.

Envy, as I stated, is just an emotion. What the person does with it is where the moral and ethical sides come into play.

If it pushes me to do better in my life, I'll almost certainly mature past that emotion.

Someone else mentioned meditation and I heartily agree, mindset is how you approach the emotions.

"Anger is a great servant but a terrible Master" -- some guy in a fantasy novel

[guerrilla]

> Feeling envious is just human nature.

Or maybe it's not and that's just something you tell yourself to feel better about being an asshole.

[malauxyeux]

Does feeling envy make someone an asshole in your eyes? Do you believe that people who feel envy can choose to not feel it? If they can't choose not to feel it, are they doomed to be an asshole (by your definition) for the rest of their lives, barring some change outside of their control?

To me, simply feeling envy (or any negative emotion) doesn't really say anything about the person. Actively stoking negative emotions or acting on them moves the needle in the direction of asshole, though.

[clausewitz]

Uhh, no. Envy, like every other human emotion, is just that. One part of the vast spectrum of how we perceive the world and its inhabitants.

[mitchdoogle]

Suppose you tell a friend about a job you're applying to, they think it sounds nice, so they apply too and they get the job and you don't. You're not jealous of that?

Or maybe your brother and you have a crush on the same woman. He asks her out and they start dating. You aren't jealous.

Or just suppose you always wanted something at home, a hot tub, a big screen tv, a walk-in closet, a home office, whatever, and you find out your friend has the thing - you'd be envious right?

It seems like you're confusing being envious of someone as a negative feeling towards them, which is why you're getting caught up on the friends and family aspect. It shouldn't matter if it's friends and family - they are often the people you know the most about so you'll find out if they do/have something you want. If you let your envy turn to anger and contempt, that's the negative part, but you don't have to - that's just having a healthy perspective and self-control

[laputan_machine]

- I've been in this situation and I was joyed for my mate, I ended up getting a better offer from elsewhere so it worked out anyway. He's still there, now as a lead architect

- This would absolutely make me jealous, but I've never been in that situation

- No, this is the weirdest one. I have friends who own huge houses (multiple!) and sports cars. I'm happy for their success, I find it genuinely mental that you would be (are? surely you have more successful friends) jealous because your mate has a better car than you. Jesus.

And I'm not "stuck" in the friends and family bit, that's been the whole context of the thread.

[sean_the_geek]

If you feel truly happy about someone else but at the same time not let it reflect on you, then I would say you are minority. The first part of my sentence is achievable and is genuinely positive , at least in a way. The second part - not letting it reflect on you - is IMO most people struggle.

[amelius]

What kind of therapy is recommended to get into this state of being?

[tappio]

Sorry, it's only available for 0.0001% of population and unfortunately you are not one of the lucky ones.

Fortunately, empathy and epistemological pluralism can make your life bearable.

[orzig]

Take it or leave it, Metta meditation is pretty squarely aimed at that. I’ve had only the tiniest bits of success, but trying a book/video/app is a ton cheaper+easier than therapy!

[sanitycheck]

I'd feel exactly the same way as you about that, and if we truly are in a tiny minority perhaps that does explain a lot about the world.

[dwringer]

Superbia versus invidia, I suppose.

[dwringer]

Indeed, it's even possible to be genuinely happy for someone but still feel inferiority and discouragement when trying to compare aspects of one's own life with others.

It's great that not everyone struggles with that, but different people struggle with different emotions. Maybe we can all agree that whatever their nature and whatever we call them is beside the point, (I think) that social media engagement optimizations have notoriously exploited these effects as they relate to our attention and habits, taking many people on an unwanted emotional roller-coaster ride for arguably unhealthy amounts of time.

[grapeskin]

I had that feeling. It pushed me to move to something better recently after stagnating for years.

It’s an ambivalent feeling. I was definitely stressed for months thinking about how much worse my life is as a consequence of comparing myself to someone else. But at the same time, I’ve lifted myself up to a higher standard since that stress turned into motivation. That friend who I felt envious of is also happy for my success, and I’m also happy for his.

[SyzygistSix]

That invokes the possibility for a better future for me as well. "Oh cool, a strategy that I can perhaps use to improve my life."