[interlocutor]

Ive may have done great work under Steve Jobs, but his work since Jobs' passing has been disastrous.

Let's consider Jony's performance on software design first. This is what some prominent people have said about iOS 7: The Verge wrote in their review: "iOS 7 isn't harder to use, just less obvious. That's a momentous change: iOS used to be so obvious." Michael Heilemann, Interface Director at Squarespace wrote, "when I look at [iOS 7 beta] I see anti-patterns and basic mistakes that should have been caught on the whiteboard before anyone even began thinking about coding it." And famed blogger John Gruber said this about iOS 7: "my guess is that [Steve Jobs] would not have supported this direction."

And what about Jony's other responsibility, industrial design? The iPod, iPhone, iPad, MacBook Air and other Apple products from Jobs era are all amazingly well designed and breathtakingly beautiful. But these products weren't designed by Jony Ive all by himself. He designed them under Steve Jobs's guidance and direction. Steve was the tastemaker. Apple's post-Steve products are nowhere near as well-designed.

Consider iPhone 5c, for example. The colors were horrid, and when you added those Crocs-like cases it looked more like a Fisher-Price toy than like a device an executive would want to be seen holding. That the 5c didn't do well in the market shouldn't surprise anyone.

As an Apple shareholder and customer I am glad Ive is gone.

[ribit]

I entirely agree that Ive's design brilliance required Job's meticulous attention to details and taste to be really successful. He did make some questionable choices after Job's passing.

And the article doesn't make much sense to me. While I don't agree with everything Cook does, Recent Apple computers are traditional Apple at its best — extremely well designed, minimalist, functional, with best in class performance, displays and portability.

[baisq]

>Consider iPhone 5c, for example. The colors were horrid, and when you added those Crocs-like cases it looked more like a Fisher-Price toy than like a device an executive would want to be seen holding.

The iPhone 5c was not a device for executives.

[rodgerd]

Exactly. It was the device well-heeled parents might get for their teens, or twenty-somethings might buy for themselves.

[88840-8855]

Personally, I found the 5c colors nice. I dont see much of a difference to those huge (ugly?) cases that people wrap around their phones today. I dont know many people who are using naked phones today and my feeling is that phones today are not designed anymore to be case-less: the camera bump, razor-sharp edges, too thin bodies.

The 5c flopped because of other reasons: it was artificially made worse than the 5s. It started with 8GB memory that was already WAY TOO LITTLE back then, it had no touchid, it had a bad camera and so much more - and yet, the price was high. Apple learned from the mistakes and changed their segmentation strategy and it worked since then (with the exception of the weird XR thing).

[perardi]

I had an iPhone XR from work. It flopped…but it was a good phone, and it was not necessarily an obviously bad idea, in my opinion.

People like big phones. The idea of a big iPhone that has contemporary guts but lacks some of the really wild camera abilities of the Max models didn’t inherently seem like the wrong plan to me. But it just kinda went nowhere, probably because you can just go buy last year’s iPhone model.

[88840-8855]

It flopped because apple did that: "here is our standard model.. and by the way, here is a cheaper, crappier model".

Now they have the approach to have a full price standard model - and there is a super duper "pro" model for the extra successful, professional and rich people.

This approach makes more sense for the consumers and this makes the 12 and 13 fly the way they do.

[Bud]

Calling this "disastrous" goes beyond hyperbole into a realm of parody, so I can only assume you're kidding.

A lot of the iOS 7 changes were positive, and those which were missteps were far from "disastrous" and have already been reversed.

If you have to go all the way back to a fringe product like the 5c, that kinda proves the opposite of your point, doesn't it? The 5c is the exception that proves the rule.

Nobody should be glad Ive is gone. It was a tremendous loss. For every decision you might disagree with, there were a hundred others that were spot-on.

[teakettle42]

I’m also very glad that Ive is gone and I think iOS 7 was a disaster that gave up an enormous UI/UX lead.

His value existed solely when his extremes were moderated by someone like Steve Jobs.

When handed the reigns, Ive ran roughshod over what made Apple — and his own work — worthwhile. He prioritized form over function, and ego over empathy.

[layer8]

The flat design introduced with iOS 7 absolutely has been disastrous for the obviousness of the UI.

[__derek__]

> But these products weren't designed by Jony Ive all by himself.

This goes for iOS 7 and the iPhone 5c as well, no?

[vineyardmike]

I think the OP is saying that they’re basically a refresh of a design that was conceived while Steve Jobs was alive.

Eg. The clean aluminum case and the black keys etc. It looks fundamentally the same.

Contrast with the butterfly keyboard, which was new in a post jobs world. And universally a disaster.

[jen20]

Not “universally”. I have a stock of 2016-18 era laptops because they are the only thing I can comfortably type on for extended periods. I prefer them to every laptop that came before and every one that has come since.

[Andrew_nenakhov]

I, for one, very much prefer the aesthetics introduced in iOS 7. The first version was rough and sometimes inconsistent, but that can be expected when the changes are so radical in such a big project.