[pengaru]

There are more efficient modes of running that aren't really available when walking, and any experienced marathoner knows how to exploit this.

It took me years of occasional running before it all clicked, despite more experienced friends having shared youtube videos on the subject. I'd always been running in a fashion more like a slowed down sprint when trying to pace myself. But that's not the efficient way, the efficient way is to logically run with your knees and let your lower legs/feet come along for the ride. Lean forward enough to prevent heel striking, and this also naturally imparts forward thrust when your foot leaves the ground in response to the knee driving forward. Your calves become more like springs storing and releasing energy, without being explicitly activated.

[alfiedotwtf]

Have you got some recommended videos? I'm trying to increase my distance and its mainly stubbornness that's keeping me going

[gumby]

I recently sprained my ankle and couldn't run (or walk). Once I could hobble around I put on my hiking boots which have some extreme ankle support and walked the dog around the neighborhood.

I was quite astonished that my stride was quite low energy. That is, I already knew approximately how many calories my watch reported if I walked (in my running shoes) the dog on a given route vs running that route. Apparently I had learned a much more efficient stride in the boot over the years, so I was able to walk the route in the usual time but by burning 20% fewer calories and at lower heart rate. I do a lot of backpacking so am used to long distance walking in those boots, but didn't know I used a different stride to do so.

This is all per my Apple Watch so take the measurements with a grain of salt. But at least it was like:like.

[agumonkey]

I had knee and slight back pain, anf always tried to mechanically aim at the smoothest impact (landing on foot ball, ensure enough forward momentum) yet,unless a high enough speed, I found it harder on my joints. To the point where jogging heel striking like a newb felt nicer. I'm still dumbfounded.

[_kulang]

Might be a function of modern shoes. I can’t heel strike on old or bad quality runners

[go_elmo]

It takes months to years for bones and non muscle tissue to adapt to new stresses. Took me 1 year of regular runs to adapt to non heel strikes, but it happens eventually.

[noman-land]

Any tips for a non-runner about how to speed up this adaptation? I've been "walking differently" for about 18 months and still feel that the foot/ankle/calf bits may not be ready for running.

[go_elmo]

I dont think theres a magic way, just optimizing regular stimuli of intermediate (not too hard) stresses is my best guess (similar to any exercising) start doing shorter routes more frequently, then increase both parameters slowly, thats how Im doing it, it got a habit and it feels great!

[agumonkey]

did you change your upper body posture and exercises too ?

[mupuff1234]

Walking is the efficient mode, but only up to a certain speed.

[xvedejas]

Is heel striking bad? I am not a runner, but I've practiced heel striking while backpacking to give myself more foot-stamina. Maybe there's a better way?

[dspillett]

In a running gait, a heal strike usually means you are hitting the ground with a straighter leg so more of the energy is going through joins instead of being absorbed by muscles and other squishier bits. This can lead to excess wear to your knees and other joints which over time (especially if you don't give yourself enough recovery and healing time after hard training periods) can lead to permanent problems.

Also, as well as the shock to your body of absorbing the impact energy this way, it is less efficient: if your more springy bits absorb the energy instead of your solid structure, then they can release some of it back in a useful direction as you push off again with that foot making it easier for you to maintain the same pace. On top of that, because the “stop” of each stride is less abrupt less energy is lost to entropy through your flesh jiggling because of inertia.

I'm pretty sure this is all different for a walking pace though, which would explain you seeing a benefit from the opposite advice. With a walking gait your forward momentum is provided & maintained by the foot rolling over the floor and pushing sideways against it, rather than striking and pushing away from it like in a sprint, with running being somewhere between (running and springing are different as much as running and walking are: a sprint is a period of acceleration or maintaining top speed, a running posture is for efficiently maintaining a cruising speed or more slowly accelerating - the mechanics, while similar, have key differences).

[Accacin]

Personally, I would say it's not even worth worrying about unless you're an elite runner.

I've been running about 10 years now, done marathons and ultra-marathons and I've have had my fair share of injuries. Not one was down to how my foot strikes the ground. Most of my problems were weak glutes and other muscles caused by sitting too much (developer lifestyle..) and incorrect footwear (in my case, too narrow).

Also, you'll find your run differently depending on how fast you run. On my fast runs, I do run on my mid/forefoot and on my easy runs, I'll be on my heel a little more.

I will say though, that once you reach a certain point focusing a little on running form will help. Things like leaning slight forward and trying to work on your cadence.

[namibj]

Well, heel striking sends shocks through your spine, unless buffered via sufficiently springy shoes.

If you have strong earmuffs, consider trying them while running, and you'll hear the shock if it travels up to your neck. Switching rapidly will probably cause injury, but I haven't heard about any sizable subset of the population being unable to adapt.

Another helpful effect is that you don't need shoes to run if you're toe-striking on a clean&smooth surface.

[vanviegen]

> Another helpful effect is that you don't need shoes to run if you're toe-striking on a clean&smooth surface.

Yes, and your running shoes can last you a decade, instead of (half) a year.

[Jtsummers]

It's a topic for running more than walking. If you're walking/hiking you aren't going to have the same kind of impact directed at your heel as a runner heel striking will.

[dilyevsky]

Coaches usually say bad but even among elite it’s common. For me mid foot is more efficient but I’ve seen too many runners with what looks like terrible form clock 2:30 marathons to think there’s a universal rule

[bluecalm]

I am curious, any names of heel striking elite runners? I would love to see the footage.

[dilyevsky]

Hey just pull any yt video analyzing finishers form with stop motion frames. You won’t see it in the lead pack on long races but otherwise it seems to be roughly 20% with slight heel striking stride

[chrisseaton]

> For me mid foot is more efficient

How on Earth do you measure this kind of thing?

[dilyevsky]

If you run with hr monitor you can see it on your watch. I can tell if I’m getting cold two days in advance

[nradov]

Heel striking is generally considered suboptimal from an efficiency and injury risk standpoint. But there are major variations in what works best due to individual physiology and type of shoes worn. There are a few elite distance runners who have had long, successful careers with heel striking even though it's supposedly "bad".

[slibhb]

Most elite distance runners heel strike.

There's no good evidence for any of the claims made r.e. heel vs. forefoot striking.

[bluecalm]

I watched a lot of footage of Olympic runners, all seem to have fore/mid foot strike. Can you share some names of elite heel striking runners?

[slibhb]

I started running three years ago and looked into this quite a bit as I had plantar fasciitis for about 6 months this past summer. My conclusion was that there's no good evidence that foot strike matters in itself. Mostly everyone agrees that "overstriding" [1] is an issue but there's also no evidence for that. Also, not all heel strikers are driving their feet brutally into the ground. For distance running, most people naturally take quick, light steps and don't come down hard (the opposite of sprinting).

Here is a study showing that, among a pool of elite distance runners, most are heel strikers: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31147098/

Here is a meta analysis arguing that there is no evidence that forefoot striking is superior: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s40279-019-01238-y

Here is a paper arguing against the arguments for forefoot striking: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/articles/PMC6189005/

The heel strike vs. forefoot strike debate is not driven by evidence. Proponents of forefoot strike are making an argument from naturalness (some say that people run on forefeet without shoes, though this is disputed and may depend on the surface) and that, intuitively, landing on your forefoot seems like it would do less damage. Those arguments may be right but there's no solid evidence for them.

[1] https://news.sanfordhealth.org/orthopedics/over-striding/#:~....

[bluecalm]

I am familiar with those studies. Still I would like to see the footage of actual elite runners heel striking. I watched quite a lot of it and haven't seen one. My suspicion is that those elite heel strikers are just midfoot strikers in shoes with pronounced heel.

As to your studies: the first one doesn't include elite runners so isn't very relevant. The other one looks like meta analysis of other older studies. I am not arguing that heel strike is definitely wrong btw I am just yet to see an elite runner using it. My intuition is that it's mainly about striking the ground when your foot/leg already moves back. It just doesn't feel natural to do it heel first at least not to me.

I am not sure why you think sprinting is about forcefully driving your foot into the ground btw. It's the opposite. It's about lightly "brushing" the ground to "push" it horizontally behind you. See for example this footage: https://youtu.be/RD_TtokBUKc

The heel doesn't even hit the ground. It's the same when you look at the elite 10k or marathon runners although there heel usually lands on the ground for a while, especially in marathon: https://youtu.be/V4L113lP_54

With those new Nike shoes it almost look like heel strike because of the heel to toe drop in the shoe.

[bitexploder]

The risk of injury between foot strike styles is rather similar. It’s not a big deal. I would definitely emphasize individual physiology. I have seen way to many folks try to change their stride too quickly and injure themselves. Same with too much running too soon for new runners. Cadence is a better predictor of injury than foot strike style. I always encourage people to work on their turn over and get their cadence off, many novice runners overstride, which is inefficient and safe to correct with higher cadence.

[bluecalm]

Some studies suggest a lot of competitive high level runners heel strike. I am not sure if any elite runners do, I've checked quite a few and I am yet to see one.

I think it's about foot under your body not in front. You may land slightly in front but the moment there is weight on the foot it should be under your body. The other way of phrasing it is make your stride longer behind you, not in front of you. Apparently some people still heel strike just a bit when doing that but when you watch slow motion footage of them it's not immediately obvious which part of the foot hits the ground first.

For me personally heel striking is very unnatural. I needed to learn to run again after my knee surgery and anything but forefoot strike hurt a lot. Today it just feels very natural to me. I am not afraid of hurting my knees anymore, if anything Achilles tendon and muscles around ankles are things I sometimes worry about. Fortunately no serious injuries yet!

[tomjakubowski]

It may be fine to do while backpacking, assuming you aren't running. The mechanics of running and walking are quite different.

[pengaru]

Yes, not only is it hard on your body but the energy lost in the strike you'd benefit from storing in your calf.

[sva_]

This is very confusing to me. I always thought absorbing the shock with your calf muscle would cost more energy.

[tremon]

You're effectively using your calf as a spring damper. The energy stored in the spring can be released on your next step.

If you're landing heel-first, that same energy needs to be dissipated by your skeletal structure.

[dilyevsky]

I don’t think the “hard on your body” part is true anymore (if it ever even was) if you use proper footwear.

[jazzyjackson]

"proper footwear" is subject of controversy, I could never run without getting shin splints in any kind of athletic shoe, I could never figure out how not to heel strike...

Finally I tried barefoot shoes and cautiously increased my distance, I can finally get to that point of leaning forward and hitting mid-foot and feeling the springiness, feels way easier but now my heartrate is the bottleneck.

[asoneth]

Tossing in a second datapoint in favor of adding some barefoot running to one's training plan.

I started running with classmates without learning proper form and had joint pain in knees and hips within the first 5 km. It never felt good and I never got faster.

I started practicing barefoot a couple times a week to work on form. After the first few (painful) lessons I managed to improve my form and I could run faster and for longer distances.

Eventually I realized I enjoyed the barefoot training sessions more than running in shoes and I (slowly) switched all my runs to barefoot shoes and sandals, though that may not be the right approach for everyone. I've done a few marathons since then and now my bottleneck seems to be free time -- I'd love to try a 50k but those longer runs eat up so much more time.

[dilyevsky]

That’s just called gaining miles slowly in progression. Most everyone has injuries when gaining too many miles/week from basically zero. If you are prone to bone injuries all that switching to mid foot or especially barefoot without addressing bone density issues will likely do is trade your shin splints for those awesome metatarsal stress fractures that take forever to heal

[8note]

On the other, you have more time with your foot on the ground where you are pushing forward

[elktea]

this is the idea behind barefoot running I believe