[snerbles]

How do you go about teaching people that are outright hostile to the command line and anything that resembles code?

Currently dealing with a snobbish painter/graphic designer who has used Microsoft Frontpage and Adobe Muse for over 20 years and just wants their GUI WYSIWYG back.

[chrsstrm]

Context. I might try something like “Frontpage is to MS Paint as writing code is to Adobe Illustrator. I’m not trying to teach you a child’s toy so you need to stick it out long enough to gain some perspective on this.” I’ve had success convincing people that the terminal isn’t “for hackers” by showing them the command line is really where everything happens like double clicking an icon is the same as running `open ~/Applications/Adobe/Creative \Cloud/Photoshop.app` and other normal operations performed with commands. It also helps to differentiate between things we’re doing just to operate/navigate vs. steps taken in the actual writing of code/building something. You can tell how much they understand by how literal they follow directions. I usually start with a whole lesson on using the command line so when we get to the actual meat of building they’ve seen many of the common commands before. It also helps if they’re on the clock and getting paid to learn vs. trying to pick a new skill on nights and weekends.

[taurusnoises]

So, in light of this (great feedback), for someone like me who's primary motivation is to increase my computer literacy so I can make better and more informed choices on how I post/interact/hang out on the web, would you recommend that I start with what you're discussing: the command line?

My thinking: if I understood basic concepts and philosophy of coding and how the "the web works," I'd be able to build build myself a simple blog, simple website, but also be less beholden to Zuck and Google platforms. Obvs I'd still be using some of it, but I'd just have more choices.

[chrsstrm]

Knowing how to use the command line will not automatically elevate your command of computers in and of itself. Operating your machine at a lower level by way of the command line will over time help you to gain more computing knowledge more as a side effect. There will come times where you will get stuck trying to use a command or series of commands or scripting something for automation and you will hit a wall - this is where you will discover the secret of all power users; knowing how to solve a problem. (Almost) no one here is a great programmer because they memorized an entire language or framework or OS. We’re great programmers because we know how to find information about our issue and apply that knowledge to come up with a solution. You make a mistake or come across something you’ve never seen before, you research and figure it out, your new knowledge helps you to not make that same mistake again and this just keeps repeating. All of computing knowledge is additive; low-level concepts and tools are the foundations for all layers of abstraction above them. So learning how to use a computer at a lower level will give you a proper base for understanding higher concepts and you’ll learn useful meta information along the way. Certainly everyone learns differently, but I would recommend diving into the command line if you want to do any sort of programming or just be a power user.

[unfocussed_mike]

You could look at hooking up a static site generator to WordPress -- the Gutenberg WYSIWYG editor is really very impressive.

Or if they are using a Mac, just give them RapidWeaver.

[marc_io]

Don’t try to make them love the terminal. They mostly won't, ever.

Just give them visual tools like Webflow, Blocs.app, Bootstrap Studio or even WordPress (now a complete visual page builder, from version 5.9 onwards).