[Loeffelmaenn]

I of course think that example is not just. However I think there a certain crimes like mass murder are beyond being forgivable. It's where I think the only just thing is vengance.

Also justice can't be objective. Put n people in a room and ask them what is just and you'll get n different answers.

[sgjohnson]

There’s actually no suitable punishment for mass murderers/war criminals/terrorists at all. There’s no righting the wrongs they have caused. There’s no rehabilitation. There’s no real punishment.

When push comes to shove, how many of them even expect to get out alive? Is death penalty really just in such a situation?

The US just puts them in ADX Florence where they are tortured mentally (complete isolation, no end in sight, basically no human interaction at all). Which is probably what they deserve, but it’s still torture.

[Loeffelmaenn]

I am not talking about death penalty. I honestly think death penalty is too lenient. After you're dead there is no more punishment. And like you said:

> how many of them even expect to get out alive?

What I would want is suffering for a long time. Now is that justice or vengance? I say it's both.

> Which is probably what they deserve

Is that not what you would describe as just?

[omgitsabird]

Justice, by definition, necessitates objectivity.

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/justice/