[rtpg]

But I mean… Ireland has a higher English proficiency?

There are of course a lot of things doable fully in English. But when running a company not mastering the native language (even when all of the people you talk to speak English!) can be a big drawback.

[ssb1]

I'm willing to bet that an American would understand the English spoken in Amsterdam better than that spoken in pubs or on playgrounds in Ireland.

[curation]

Having lived in the Netherlands (Eindhoven - not even Amsterdam) I can confirm that the English spoken there was superior to the English I was raised in in rural Ontario where my teachers said "warshing" instead of washing. The Dutch have an incredibly faculty for language and I admire it.

[consp]

I will have to mention that this varies all over, especially the bit older generation (not exclusively though) also has some weird quirks language wise. So while they might speak and understand the English language quite well the are some parts missing. As an example I like to mention the phrasing of Bolkenstein (a Dutch National/EU politician) of economic handouts to people as "Golden showers". So while proficiency might be high, it's not always ... perfect.

[ben_w]

Even among native speakers, there are often inter-generational shifts: to my father’s generation (1939) “gay” meant “festive, joyous” rather than a sexual preference; my mother used the term “glory hole” to mean “a cupboard used for storage”[0]; and her mother used “Irish” as an insult, and lived just long enough for “wireless” to start to refer to WiFi instead of longwave radio.

[0] admittedly she was starting to develop signs of Alzheimer’s at the point she called it that around me, but that was a legitimate use of the phrase when she was young.

[Digit-Al]

To be fair, we in the UK often talk about the government giving us a golden shower as well. We do phrase it "slightly" differently though :-/

[midasuni]

America calls it “trickle down”, but the principles the same

[repsilat]

I guess if you mean "money is a small amount of liquid" then the analogy is fair? Otherwise the terms are very different -- handouts are not called "trickle down" in the US. The principle is not the same, it is literally the opposite.

"Trickle down" in the US is a term used to disparage the idea that a strong economy benefits the poor even in the absence of explicit redistribution.

[radiator]

I for one don't see the problem in this particular case. To say that giving everyone money is like a golden shower, is an apt simile in my opinion.

[ido]

In the off chance this is not a joke: in colloquial English this means they are pissing on you (golden being the color of urine).

[123pie123]

I'm from the UK and whilst working with a handful of dutch, I was blown away not only by their extremely good english but also their ability to understand and the subitle aspects of english - eg comedy/ sarcasium/ passive aggresstion etc..

[ido]

Dutch is probably the closest language to English that isn’t a dialect of English.

[dfawcus]

No, that would have to be Scots. Especially compared to the region versions of English spoken in Northern England.

It should not be too surprising, given that Scots in large part derived from Northumbrian Old English, with various admixtures including from Scandinavia.

The versions of English spoken in Northern England also had a large input from Norse due to the Dane Law period, and that is part of what drove the change to modern English.

That said, in viewing un-dubbed (but subtitled) Dutch, Belgium, and Swedish TV programs, I have been surprised by the amount I get the gist of directly from the speech. Generally from the core Germanic portion of the languages. Belgium was also interesting due to the occasional mix of stock French phrases and words.

There were a non trivial quantity of 'English' words used, and usually for identical meaning, or a similar gloss.

[ido]

Fair enough, but Dutch is a much more “major” language than Scots (which I believe even in Scotland only a small % of the population speak as their first/mother tongue rather than English).

[sumedh]

> Dutch is probably the closest language to English that isn’t a dialect of English.

I still remember hearing two Dutch guys speak in Dutch, I thought there were speaking in English but then I realised I dont understand what they are saying.

[Y_Y]

That's an important point. Note that depending on definitions you might say (West) Frisian of Lowlands Scots claims this title.

[tremon]

Part of that is probably because we have (grandfathered) access to BBC1 and BBC2 here, so ample opportunity to learn British mannerisms and expressions.

[Kaius]

Would that American be from inner city Baltimore? Or from a fishing boat off the coast of Louisiana? Or from the Ozarks perhaps?

[WaxProlix]

What about in office spaces?

[nixass]

But the US company in Europe would have far more (big majority) of non-US employees. Those employees have far better understanding of Dutch English than Irish English in every day and in corporate life

[ithkuil]

There are some workers that would relocate with the whole family.

This means the significant other has to find a job and fit it, kids have to go to school.

While many countries have a very decent proficiency in English, you're whole family must fully invest in learning the local language. And that in addition to using English in the office of at least one of the adults (since many big companies use English officially)

[microtonal]

There are some workers that would relocate with the whole family. This means the significant other has to find a job and fit it, kids have to go to school.

Like e.g. Berlin, the large Dutch cities are very much internationally-oriented and usually it's not problem to get a job and integrate if you don't speak Dutch. Sometimes the issue is quite the opposite -- my wife wanted to learn Dutch, but people would just switch to English or German and she would have to ask them explicitly to speak Dutch.

This means the significant other has to find a job and fit it, kids have to go to school.

Kids pick up other languages in no time. A lot of friends/colleagues moved between countries (academia) and the kids would usually pick up a language in 2-3 months. I have lived in Australia for six months when I was four. When we returned, I spoke English with an aussie accent (though that's gone now ;)).

[jan_Inkepa]

Living in Berlin if you don't speak German you are limited in employment, in healthcare, and possibly socially depending on your bubbles. Short time you may not notice it but long term you are probably best learning German. A friend of mine is struggling to find a job right now and lack of German is a big problem for them. Another friend started dating someone who's not herself in the anglophone tech bubble and can't hang out with her friends. Have translated for a friend in hospital for a operation.

Some people can deal with this, even long term, but it's definitely not for me.

[lrem]

Maybe? A Polish colleague happened to spend some time with, IIRC, a Scott and an Aussie. The two native speakers would resort occasionally to use him as an interpreter, because the native English tends to diverge out of bounds of their tolerances.

[te_chris]

All this chat about spoken and nothing about legal systems.