[throwawayboise]

McDonald's and similar jobs used to be an entry level job for teens and college students. When I was 16 I was happy to work there for minimum wage ($3.35/hr at the time). Nobody other than the mangers did it to support a family. It was never understood to be that kind of job. I don't know how we got to the point where a no-skills-required job that anyone with a pulse can learn to do in a few hours suddenly became required to support a family of four.

[tshaddox]

> I don't know how we got to the point where a no-skills-required job that anyone with a pulse can learn to do in a few hours suddenly became required to support a family of four.

That's an odd way of looking at it. Surely what happened first isn't that the expectations of fast food jobs changed out of the blue. Could it instead be that other jobs which adults worked to support their families went away?

[lazerpants]

The population also exploded from ~280MM in 2000 to an estimated 331MM in 2020... so maybe all of those extra people created a glut of workers.

[cratermoon]

> Nobody other than the mangers did it to support a family. It was never understood to be that kind of job

Wrong.

"From the beginning, the minimum wage was meant to be a living wage—meaning families could live off of the pay comfortably, rather than struggling paycheck-to-paycheck" https://www.lendio.com/blog/minimum-wage-livable/

[hed]

There are claims that it was meant to keep black people out of the workforce.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carriesheffield/2014/04/29/on-t...

[mortehu]

The linked article doesn't really substantiate that claim, and even so it doesn't actually contradict GP's claim about the McDonald's job.

[cratermoon]

You're correct, McDonald's (and plenty of other large employers) probably never thought or cared whether or not their minimum wage jobs were for teenagers or parents with families. To them, it was just the least they were legally allowed to pay, and therefore just a cost to be minimized as much as possible.

[ashtonkem]

1) The idea that McDonald’s used to be primarily staffed with students doesn’t carry water. How would the store run during school hours? Students can’t run a store when they need to be in class, someone else has to do that.

2) Have you actually looked back and compared that salary to the cost of living back then? I think you might be surprised how many people could, and were, supporting a family on a job that “anyone with a pulse” could do.

[yupper32]

> McDonald's and similar jobs used to be an entry level job for teens and college students. When I was 16 I was happy to work there for minimum wage

And who worked the day shift?

[bluGill]

Spouses who needed to get out of the house while their other half was at work. They loved going to work with the same friends every day, chatting while cleaning up after the lunch shift... There was enough work to not be bored.

There are a lot of people who like having a job, but don't really need the money. Those that need the money move up to management if they can.

[ashtonkem]

> There are a lot of people who like having a job, but don't really need the money.

These people exist, I do not believe that any of them work at fast food restaurants. That’s an incredible amount of stress to put yourself through to “get out of the house” and meet new people.

> Those that need the money move up to management if they can.

I think you’re overestimating the size of management by quite a bit.

[bluGill]

Once you learn the job fast food is not stressful. It is hard work, but entirely routine.

Most people decide fast food management isn't for them, and move elsewhere. The ones who remain dropped out and need the free training.

[ashtonkem]

Did you read the article? It directly countermands everything you’re saying. I personally can’t figure out why you’d make a claim that’s such transparent nonsense.

> Most people decide fast food management isn't for them, and move elsewhere.

Perhaps it was too stressful? Just a thought.

[bluGill]

I have personally been in fast food, and I worked my way up to management. If what I say contradicts the article, then my personal experience contradicts the article.

Management is more stressful. That is a different from the line worker who has been working the same position for the last 5 years, with no interest in advancing. I saw several people refuse advancements because they didn't want the stress: they knew how to do their job and it wasn't stressful at all anymore. (they learned to shut off the customer who yells at them while the cook is behind on orders - this coping is an important skill)

[watwut]

Many of those spouses in fact needed money.

[ashtonkem]

Exactly. There are all kinds of better social outlets if you don’t need money; book clubs, knitting groups, and game nights exist precisely to fill that need. The idea that you’d go work at McDonald’s for funsies rather than out of economic necessity just doesn’t pass the sniff test.

[HarryHirsch]

I don't know how we got to the point where a no-skills-required job that anyone with a pulse can learn to do in a few hours suddenly became required to support a family of four.

Deskilling, derisking, outsourcing. Companies used to run their own email, which required a competent mailadmin, nowadays you outsource it to Google or Microsoft.

[Johnny555]

Companies used to run their own email, which required a competent mailadmin, nowadays you outsource it to Google or Microsoft.

Most companies didn't hire a competent mail admin, their IT guy would run Exchange on the company fileserver as a part of his other duties.

Most of the large companies that used to hire a competent mail admin to run their mail servers still run their own mail servers.

[pessimizer]

I don't know where you grew up, but it still looks that way in fairly affluent suburbs. In the city, the fast food workforce is 75% immigrant single mothers.

[lumost]

The minimum wage was set to $3.35/hr in 1981, a time when 22.2% of Americans were employed in manufacturing vs. 10% today. There were many alternatives to working at McDonalds that stopped existing in the US over the last 40 years. The ultimate answer to what Americans would do instead of manufacturing turned out to be restaurant and retail work.

[ashtonkem]

Also, consider the relative increase in housing, education, and medical care over that period of time. The inflation adjusted median home was about $178,000 in 1981, It’s $314,000 now.

[watwut]

It used to be that most jobs were easy to learn.