[WalterBright]

> spending a career at someone else's company

The nice thing about working for someone else's company is you work 40 hours, then it leaves your mind for the rest of the time. If there's some problem at work, it's usually "not in my job description." Like, printer doesn't work? Call the Department of Inhuman Resources. Not your problem.

If you work for yourself, it's 24/7. No vacations, either. All problems are your problem. Printer quit? Whatcha gonna do about it? It isn't for everyone.

[imgabe]

Maybe it's better to have problems you care about. Solving problems that aren't directly related to your well-being is unnatural. That's not how humans evolved. Until fairly recently in human history, if you had a problem in your work (which was probably farming), it was a direct threat to your survival that demanded your attention. You cared deeply about it and solving it in the best way possible mattered immensely.

I'm not saying we should go back to being one problem away from death, but also solving problems that just fundamentally don't matter to us personally doesn't seem to be great either.

[WalterBright]

Back when I had a bunch of employees, I was awake many nights worrying about meeting payroll.

But working for someone else - payroll was not my department.

[samatman]

The grass is always greener, right? But this is pretty idealistic.

Picture changes drastically if you have an abusive boss or a toxic work culture. There have to be a bunch of people on HN who physically cringed when they saw 40 hours, some have even talked themselves into being macho about it.

[epicureanideal]

> There have to be a bunch of people on HN who physically cringed when they saw 40 hours

I'm one of them.

[WalterBright]

Nobody is making you work for an abusive boss. Quit.

[mancerayder]

The people in the 40 hours, though, dream of the working for yourself, at least you're the cause of success and failure instead of an unpredictable re-org, a new boss, a rapid company expansion or shrinking, a colleague who wants your throat, etc.

But a 24/7 stress of self-employment is not for the faint of heart either. What's the compromise?

[lelandbatey]

The compromise is to work somewhere, usually somewhere small, where you don't have unpredictable re-orgs, new bosses all the time, rapid company expansions/shrinkages, colleagues who want your throat, etc. It especially helps if it's somewhere there's mutual trust between everyone to say "hey, I think this is the most important thing so I'm going to take X days/weeks and work on this. Things will be better/more efficient/more profitable/easier in Q ways as a result." And then you do it, and things are better, and the business chugs along.

Such places don't exist forever, and they don't tend to be massive growth situations. But they are probably what many people yearn for.

[garrickvanburen]

I was my worst boss. For a long time. Took 5(+?) yrs to recover.

[WalterBright]

> at least you're the cause of success and failure

If only most people realized that :-)

[blaser-waffle]

> The nice thing about working for someone else's company is you work 40 hours

What in modern society (or even this website) makes you think it's only 40 hours?

Or that you can just go "not my problem boss" -- in an At Will state that can literally get you fired on the spot.

> If you work for yourself, it's 24/7. No vacations, either. All problems are your problem. Printer quit? Whatcha gonna do about it? It isn't for everyone.

Bullocks. You set the hours as a contractor -- literally, in the contact. This is standard freelance stuff.

[baumy]

> What in modern society (or even this website) makes you think it's only 40 hours?

The jobs I've held for the entirety of my so-far 8 year career, where I can count on my hands the number of times I've worked more than 40 hours in a week.

> Or that you can just go "not my problem boss" -- in an At Will state that can literally get you fired on the spot.

The fact that I've done that, many times, and not gotten fired. If you are skilled and a good performer, you have a lot of leverage, doubly so in the current job market.

> Bullocks. You set the hours as a contractor -- literally, in the contact. This is standard freelance stuff.

What happens when a client decides not to pay you? What happens when you can't find enough work to make whatever amount you want to make? How do you establish a reliable client base that won't saddle you with those first 2 problems in the first place? That's just the tip of the iceberg of problems you'll have to deal with on your own if you go the freelance route, which a salaried job will abstract away from you. Not everyone wants to deal with those issues; I certainly don't.

[WalterBright]

> What in modern society (or even this website) makes you think it's only 40 hours?

Rush hour times makes it pretty obvious. Another thing is I've worked as both employer and employee. People leave after 8 hours.

> You set the hours as a contractor -- literally, in the contact.

Your 40 hour employee contract says 40 hours, literally. Why are you able to stand up for yourself as a contractor (who can be shown the door any second) but not as an employee?

> in an At Will state that can literally get you fired on the spot

Only if they are looking for an excuse to get rid of you anyway. And contractors are easy to fire on the spot, there are no legal restrictions on that.

Also, if you're a contractor, you spend a lot of time looking for contracts. 24/7.

[mylons]

i realize this is my problem, but lately i can’t leave it at 40 hours. i sometimes wake up completely absorbed with things i think are bad decisions and that deeply frustrate me at work. or i’ll think about the lack of prestige and recognition i’m getting.

[xenihn]

Everyone I know who has their own business (or businesses) does less than ten hours a week of "real" work. You only work 24/7 if you don't delegate responsibilities properly, or if your company is mainly just you.