[alphadevx]

Wow that's a pretty easy going list. Just wait until you have to fire a bad hire that you made, have an entire team quit after a bad crunch, or have to lay off an entire team due to that exciting startup just you joined going bust.

[korginator]

This is hard, specially when you have very little control over the root cause of the problem.

Some years ago I was in a small company going through a cash flow problem. We had zero revenues for two straight quarters, cut salaries, laid off people, and drove the remaining developers to burn out by treating the situation as BAU instead of the crisis that it was.

I would dread those conversations with the engineers, telling them there's no more work. They were very good people and we're still well connected but it sucks when this happens.

When this happens, morale is at rock bottom and the smart ones start to quit. Been through this too, until the team was just me and 2 more engineers trying to do the work of eight people, until everyone quit for saner roles.

The company is still trying to generate some cash, they're around like a zombie.

[tyrex2017]

One note: For me it is much harder if I had control of the root cause because then it is my fault and I am crushing myself about how I was wrong etc.

If it’s some others fault, you can be sad but shrug it off more easily. Also, the others wont be as mad towards you.

[shortandsweet]

Have you had that happen?

[alphadevx]

Yes and I could go on! Engineering management is brilliant and rewarding, but also very demanding.

I have made plenty of mistakes over 20+ years, and learned the painful way.

All of your problems are people problems, the tech parts are much easier to manage.

[brutus1213]

I'm a senior technical IC (have a phd in tech along with many years of exp) who moved to management about 2 years back. I am having very mixed feelings on being on the other side. Being a manager is a lot harder than I expected. It feels like wading in slush all day long and I don't really get a sense of accomplishment (as an IC, I could take credit for what I did; as a mgr, I definitely add value and am a force multiplier to the team .. be it in setting direction, utilizing learnings from all my old experiences .. it just doesn't feel the same in terms of pride in technical achievement .. i.e. my coding days are over). I am also completely clueless how to switch jobs as a manager. Any insights would be greatly appreciated.

[alphadevx]

> I am also completely clueless how to switch jobs as a manager. Any insights would be greatly appreciated.

I share my own (humble) insights right here, its a huge topic but I post regularly, you might find some of those posts helpful: https://techleader.pro/

> it just doesn't feel the same in terms of pride in technical achievement .. i.e. my coding days are over

Same for me, I had to learn to take pride in building successful teams and individuals, and not code anymore.

As an ex-engineer, the key "eureka!" moment I had was when I realized that management != leadership, and leadership > management. After that, I started to study "leadership" as a formal topic, everyone from Marcus Aurelius to Steve Jobs, as if I was learning a new programming language for example.

The combination of technical chops + great people leadership skills is very rare, if you nail that many opportunities will open up for you during your career.

Wish you well on your journey.

[nednar]

Is there a network of managers in your company you could sync with? If you consider switching companies or even career paths you might be at a point where learning might be more important than keeping (secret sauce type) leverage or saving face.

How much time do you spend on helping your team members grow? It takes a long time (years not weeks), but this can be very rewarding!

[vincentmarle]

> All of your problems are people problems, the tech parts are much easier to manage.

This cannot be emphasized enough. I have seen lots of smart engineers attempting to "architect" the engineering manager role, while not being able to handle the people aspect at all.

[fma]

I have an opportunity to apply (and be very competitive) for manager positions that just opened up and this is the part that scares me the most. I could (and likely will) be managing a team of 9 college hires with 1 senior dev. Not a great ratio but that's about what it is from the new teams that were created.

I can stay technical in my role as an individual contributor and be content. IMHO I'd be more valuable to the company in a leadership role...but also at the same time not sure if I want to have to deal with it for a 10% raise.

[alphadevx]

I'd always recommend you try it! The really brilliant part about engineering leadership is mentoring, there is nothing more rewarding than seeing one of your teams succeed, or growing your own leaders and watching them thrive autonomously.

If it does not suit you in the end, your technical skills will still be there as a fallback option.

Wish you well.

[fma]

A part of my does want to try it because rarely does my company opening up so many managerial spots (we are in a growth phase). I wonder if anyone has "falling back"? And how that experience was. Is there a stigma? I assume there was a paycut?

Funny thing is I'd feel less pressure as a senior dev with 9 other college hires, than a new manager w/ 1 senior dev and 9 college hires (even though technically the team would have 2 senior devs including me if the development parts get rough!).

[ojn]

Be careful about diving in and doing too much work yourself as a developer. If you do, sure, your team now has 11 engineers instead of 10. 10% bump!

What can you, as their manager, do to instead increase their productivity by 10%? Likely many things, and this is a lot more sustainable, because otherwise the team gets neglected from a manager support perspective while you're busy working with them.

Of course, find things to do technically to help the team if you want, that's a great idea. But don't assume that the best thing you can do for them is always to do what they are doing.

[gkop]

Re: going from management back to IC, yes I’ve done it, not within the same company though. It was a good experience for me. Later, I swung back to management.

This resonated with me and made me excited to fall back to an IC role for a period: https://charity.wtf/2017/05/11/the-engineer-manager-pendulum...

[tchalla]

> All of your problems are people problems, the tech parts are much easier to manage.

That's just ... management. Management is mostly about people, it is mostly about the HOW instead of the WHAT. I'd go one step ahead and make a statement that "Management is mostly about dealing with people's observable behaviours".

[alphadevx]

You can't "manage observable people behaviours", they are complex human beings with unique emotions and motivations, each one behaves differently.

If you try to "manage" that, they will resent and resist you.

The best you can hope for is that they like and respect you enough to follow your leadership. But that's their choice.

[einpoklum]

> have an entire team quit after a bad crunch

You're claiming that is unavoidable? Hmm. I wonder.

[alphadevx]

Did I?

[muspimerol]

Well, to be fair, the article is about "Mistakes I've made", not "Hard things I've had to do".

[alphadevx]

My mistakes contributed to those hard things.

I did not "claiming that is unavoidable" on this thread, if you care about being fair.