[TheRevoltingX]

I never even finished High School, and now I earn more/do less than my college degree holding co-workers. I have the advantage of being a programmer though, where skill is at least measurable to some degree and college education isn't as important.

It's actually taboo, but we now assume that someone who graduated from college probably sucks but is willing to do boring tasks.

[dedward]

I'm curious to know your thoughts on what your feelings are on your own children's educations. Will you advise them to drop out of highschool and start working? Are you expecting them to go to university?

[tnuoccaetaerc]

I'll take a shot at this. High school drop out, quickly got a GED at 18, never went to UNI, 6 years later making a mid six figure salary as a programmer. Have 2 year old kid.

While I make a good salary and will probably continue to do so for the rest of my life (particularly because on of my present motivations is to start a company of my own), the driving factor behind my success has been my upbringing. I grew up in a shattered immigrant family. We never had enough money. It was gigantic source of stress for me. Constant fights between parents, moving at least once every two years, always made fun of for the way I dressed and carried myself. Never really had any friends.

My only recourse at the time was to fall into petty criminal activity and associating myself with hoods. "Lucky" for me, the constant moving due to being broke prevented me from creating any long lasting relationships with scum.

Eventually I found myself living in a small town far away from where I grew up. No friends. No skills. Too scared/smart to do anything illegal.

I spent the entirety of my time over the course of 4 years learning software development. I took on side projects that I was way under qualified for and learned as I went. My only motivation was money so we could eat. This was my college education. I didn't spend any time enjoying myself (other than playing video games between working). I worked for 12-16 hours per day, 7 days a week, no exaggeration.

The side effects of this? I still don't have any friends (most people made them in uni or carried them over from high school). While I do have interests and several personal hobbies, I don't do anything particularly well other than my work. The overwork of those 4 years became a part of my personality. All I do is work. Actually, it's Sunday and I'm working in a coffee shop right now. Yesterday I spent the beginning part of my day with my kid, then after noon I worked until 9pm. I'm not complaining or whining; I'm actively working on fixing the things that were broken due to my early life experience. In ~5 years I expect to restore a sense of normality to my life, but I'll never stop working like a maniac :)

The reason I told you this story is to emphasize how important it is to have a drive. It doesn't matter what your driving factor is. Could get getting laid. Could be money. Could be fame. Could a fear of being broke. Could be a fear of failure.

I don't expect my son to relive my life because he has a stable home with 2 loving parents. Instead, I will rigorously push the status quo. He must get good grades. He must go to university. Then I'll see how he handles it and make changes according to what I believe is good for him.

If he fails miserably at school, I'll try to understand why. Is it because he's an idiot, that is, mentally incapable of doing the work? Then I'll be happy if he becomes an auto mechanic and doesn't fall into drugs/crime. Is it because he isn't challenged enough and doesn't like school? That's fine, but he will be responsible for supporting himself the minute he believes he's an adult.

So all in all, I don't care if my kid goes to uni. I don't care if he does. What I care about is him having the motivation, drive, and passion to do something productive and contribute to society.

[TheRevoltingX]

Well, I'd have to admit that not every kid excels at something, or is special, including my own. That decision seems like it would need to happen as the child is growing up. If they exhibit signs of being fast learners where the education system is actually slowing them down. Then yes, I'd probably advise them not to go. Or if they want to go, to try their best to get at a top-tier school (i.e. MIT.) Certainly things like Devry and Phoneix university I would consider a joke.

However, if they exhibit signs of being average then I would push them to get a degree. Because at least they'll know how to follow some sort of procedure and get a decent job without really needing to excel beyond their peers.

In reality though, I'm sure it won't be such a black and white problem.

[flooser]

eg. instead of i.e., and yes, I did go to M.I.T.

[tnuoccaetaerc]

Forgot to mention something. One of the other side effects of not going to university is that I wasn't exposed to the "pop culture of education" as I call it. That is to say, I wasn't exposed to common classical literary works, authors, composers, music, etc.

Often times I find myself in the middle of a conversation about greek philosophy with some coworkers, for example. Mind you none of these people are anywhere expert level in these topics but they all have an introductory set of knowledge to draw from. I have nothing. Luckily, my parents (as crazy as they were) were HIGHLY intellectual and infused some knowledge in stubborn brain. When I was a kid, my mom FORCED me to spend 1 hour per day reading classic literature. Damn I hated that. So now when people bring up War and Peace, I'm like, "Yea I read that" (whoo)

Anyway, point is there are side effects that are usually untold.

[ams6110]

I have a BS degree and was not exposed to any of that at university. Not to say it wasn't available, I just chose other courses.

[jf271]

I told my kids to stay out of IT. All of them were capable of working in the industry but that last ten years has ruined IT and programming as a profession. This country has ruined it as a profession by letting too many unqualified people into this country as H1Bs. Before you scream racist, there are way too many people with EE degrees are here as programmers without any chops to make a difference. It cheapens the profession.

My oldest is an Athletic Trainer and will never be outsourced. The twins are totally different. One is in textbook editing and the other will end up as a college soccer coach. At least they won't have to worry about this country undercutting what should be a professional wage.