[autocorr]

For some context, this project was basically made to one up someone else, so it's not fully serious. Part of what makes the keyboard funny though is that (a niche of) the custom mechanical keyboard scene has been moving to many fewer keys and programming the firmware to compensate. So it's pretty funny going from seeing several Planck ~49 key layouts to seeing this gargantuan 450 key absolute unit.

Sincerely typed by someone on a 44 key layout :)

[codezero]

Is it an Atreus? How do you like that size of keyboard? I'm not too bothered about adopting some chords, but more interested in the general ergonomics / RSI risks.

[readingnews]

I am not OP, but I moved to a 40% (44 key minivan) about a year ago, and I am using it as my daily driver at home and work. I find that the fact that I can reach every key on the board and barely move my hands has helped a lot. The other interesting notation is that I can put the mouse really, really close by. So the motion going from keyboard to mouse is greatly reduced. I find that my wrists are much better off with this.

[codezero]

That's helpful, I think the space and movement is definitely an issue w/ my RSI, but I have a feeling the chords might end up taking over if I swap out, but may give it a shot :)

[EForEndeavour]

What sort of WPM did you have on normal keyboards, and whta have you been able to train up to on your current one? I plateaued at roughly 35 WPM on Dvorak as a teenager and have been hesitant to commit to major layout changes since then, despite the ergonomic promises that a lot of them make.

[readingnews]

I am the minivan owner... I find that my WPM did not move significantly. In fact, I would argue that for the most part my typing speed is the same. Now, when it gets to coding, or {}, [], things slow down just a tiny bit, but with todays editors, this can be minimized.

I will admit, I have been in IT for many years. I feel like unless you are an accountant, or someone that has to hit {} [] constantly and can not deal with macros, that the 60%, 40% keyboards help a lot. Most CS/sysadmin/engineer type people are good with layering anyway.

I will say this, on a normal keyboard, you have to hit shift to do a few odds and ends. On a 40%, you would be amazed at the speed that you pikcup "oh, hey, {} and [] are over here, just I have to hold down this one key, just like shifting on an normal keyboard... ok, I get it" and then by week two you no longer think about it. Just my $0.02. I did, however, test my typing speed on one of those online things. I really did not change much after about a month from my previous keyboard to the minivan.

[chrisco255]

I code in JavaScript and typing {} and [] is like 90% of the work.

[sascha_sl]

You can keep the normal layout on a 40%, you just wouldn't have number/function/nav keys without layers

40% is not just plank, and I personally find the ergonomics of a plank board to be rather bad compared to staggered, unless it's split.

[simias]

I definitely agree with you here, I like split ortho a lot (I'm typing this on an ergodox) but I'm super doubtful of any benefit for non-split orthos. My arms don't sprout from the center of my chest!

[alpaca128]

I actually prefer non-split orthos but with a split layout. What I mean with that is something similar to split keyboards but angled and within one case. This is still very ergonomic but more portable. Combined with columnar stagger and reduced to about 42 keys I find it extremely comfortable to type on.

[EForEndeavour]

That reminds me, I consider losing arrow keys a dealbreaker. I use them frequently enough to navigate both text and code in various contexts (except in Vim, which I don't use exclusively). I already hold modifiers to jump to next/prev word boundary, page, start/end of continuous data ranges in Excel, etc. Admittedly, I'd probably adapt, but I'm held back by the belief that any ergonomic advantages of moving to wasd or hjkl would be wiped out by reduction in speed and muscle memory for me.

[Symbiote]

I had similar misgivings, so I chose an ErgoDash, which has a few more keys than some of the minimalist offerings. I have the arrow keys in a horizontal row (which took some time to adapt to), but I can still use them with Alt/Ctrl/Shift modifiers fairly easily.

However, I'm planning on making something like this[1] "trackball Dactyl Manuform", where the trackball under the thumb can be configured to use different modes -- e.g. a key toggles it between being a mouse and being arrow keys, and another locks it to vertical/horizontal. It could be combined with holding Alt/Ctrl/Shift.

I made a gallery of split/ergonomic mechanical keyboards if you'd like a quick overview of other options. [2]

[1] https://medium.com/@kincade/track-beast-build-log-a-trackbal...

[2] https://aposymbiont.github.io/split-keyboards/

[gonehome]

HHKB has worked well for me, it moves the arrow keys closer to your right hand in a much better location than most 60% boards default.

You can easily use your right pinky to hit Fn and then use the arrow keys that are right under your fingers (I think it's actually better than normal keyboard arrow key placement).

I don't think I could go below a 60% board because having the number row is too useful and dealing with function layers for that (and memorizing symbol placement) seems like an unnecessary pain for style.

[SuperPaintMan]

With light switches and a compact layout it's not too bad for navigation. My default for arrows is LeftThumb+HJKL, so it's quicker and more natural then diving for the arrow keys. I also have overloaded alphas (Ctrl on a or ;, Shift on Z/?, etc) so Ctrl-Shift-Up maps to A+Z+LeftThumb+K. Seems a little bonkers but it only took a few days to adjust to my GergoPlex [0][1]

The bigger issue with adding more keys to the mix is that with heavier switches (35g+) the amount of work/stress done by the hand can be more then a traditional keyboard. But even with heavier switches it's often faster then having to move your hands around the physical board. And once you factor in things like combos you can just map End to something like QW or whatever works for you. Programmable input devices are _really_ weird!

[0] https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rRS_TOYuIQQ/XhRERox3moI/AAAAAAABE...

[1] https://www.gboards.ca/product/gergoplex

[simias]

I don't have arrow keys on my board but I have something better: I have a special modifier that lets me use readline-style commands (C-n for down, C-p for up, C-h for backspace, C-d for delete etc...) anywhere without requiring the app to support it, since it sends the compatible down/up/backspace/delete/... keycode instead.

I finally don't have to worry about this or that program not supporting this or that binding, it's uniform everywhere.

You say that you already use hjkl (I assume?) in Vim, so clearly you have the muscle memory for that, why not extend it to all applications?

And there's so much more to programmable keyboards. Modifier keys that input characters when pressed on their own, allowing for dual function. Some people like remapping caps lock to control, others to escape. Why not both? My keyboard has a key that behaves like control when chorded and like escape when pressed on its own. The best of both worlds!

[readingnews]

On most 40% layouts, incredibly, you can keep the arrow keys. Look it up.

[autocorr]

A DIY custom actually![1] It's a split with 3 x 6 alphas, 3 thumb keys, and a palm key. I really like it but I was already moving in the direction on layout-minimalism on my ErgoDox. You can find a pic of my layout here[2]. Happy to answer any questions about it.

On ergonomics and RSI, tough to say whether some of these things make a difference or not. There's no data. The single biggest difference to me is having multiple thumb keys because that allows you to almost completely relieve the pinkies. The only sideways movement I use them for now is a "sticky keys" style one-shot modifier for Control on the keys adjacent to the home-row. Although having a split board (and standing desk) has been super for overall posture.

[1] https://www.reddit.com/r/ErgoMechKeyboards/comments/infzme/t... [2] http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/gists/8105b7f97f89fa...

[wyclif]

In Vim, I would love to be able to map Ctrl-[ (which is what I use instead of Esc to change modes) to Ctrl-thumbkey just to relieve the right pinky. I'm using a standard mechanical TKL layout now. Or maybe just map Esc to a single thumb key.

[autocorr]

Yeah as a heavy vimmer I also used Ctrl-[ with Caps-as-Ctrl for the longest time on a regular full-sized keyboard. Esc is great to have on a thumb key though. I used it on one of the outer ones on my ErgoDox and it worked well. A nice vim quality of life improvement was programming keyboard macros for `Esc : w Enter` and for quit.

It's not new in the vim world, but now what I use is `jk` pressed at the same time. Adjacent finger pairs are pretty easy to coordinate fast combos with -- just sort of jab your hand. Since it's in the keyboard firmware (QMK) it works in all contexts and not just vim, but the `jk` combo is also something that I can configure in the vimrc to use on my laptop.

[codezero]

Thanks for sharing, that’s something else!

[kortex]

Also not autocorr but I've had tons of fun with my Ergodox EZ. The layout relies on using the thumbs to chord layers, right now there's 6 (I actually started running out of useful codes/actions to put into slots, need to get into macros next). the 30 keys in the home row and above/below plus thumbs see heavy usage.

Thumbs do L3, space, L1, escape, L2, L4, control.

L0: dvorak

L1: programmer, left hand symbols (all 4 braces paired under middle and index), right hand arrow keys, nav, pgup/pgdn. Vimlike navigation at the keyboard level!

L2: left hand function keys, right hand numpad

L3: qwerty layout but with command so I get natural one-hand undo/cut/copy/paste

L4: mouse keys. Not a big fan of mouse nav, but keyboard issuing scroll up/down is handy

L1+L2: macros live here, I use this to eg. flip between iterm tabs. I desperately need more bucky/control bits though - It's hard to know which hotkeys are mapped across various applications. Give me a real Meta key, dangit!

This lets me rarely move from home position and it's great for ergonomics. Still trying to figure out what to about the mouse, as that makes my hand cramp. I keep a magic trackpad between the ergodox halves for gestures which is neat. But the dang mouse. Maybe it's the way my brain works, but I'm rarely in a single context, flipping between Pycharm and chrome and terminal constantly. Controlling application focus is a pain point.

I can't do the vim thing. I've tried for years. I'm a fast yet inaccurate typer, and the lack of any insight into the state (other than mode), and the heavy chording setup means spooky action constantly happens. I also hate having to hit a key for mode changes, chording is so much more efficient.

I use bettertouchtool and alfred, and don't have a lot of customization in there, so if anyone has any tips for utilizing this sort of setup to reduce mouse reliance, I'm all ears.