Moissanite my friend. Save money for things that you enjoy (travelling, hobbies, concerts) and avoid funding a dirty industry (dirty in every sense of the word).
Bold statement to make about 3,500,000,000 people. That thinking rationally is impossible for their heads.
For what's worth my girlfriend already made it clear that she would be very upset if I ever bought her such expensive jewellery, precisely because of lost opportunity cost in things like enjoyable trips through Europe, attending concerts/plays and that sort of actually meaningful experiences. So hey, there goes your theory?
Unless someone's seen a study on this, neither of you is more right than the other.
Some will hear nothing more than 'not a diamond', and some will say 'you wasted how much'.
What're you going to do, if you're even thinking about it you're obviously set on her, so it only matters how she feels about them to the extent that you know!
> Unless someone's seen a study on this, neither of you is more right than the other.
Well, if one person makes a blanket statement about all individuals in a group, and the other disproves that with a single individual to which the statement does not apply, one of them clearly is more right than the other.
Ok he should have said "many" or "most" : does it change the underlying face behind his statement ?
I don't have any statistics, but it seems obvious the group of women desiring diamonds is bigger (to say the least) than the group of women not interested by them.
Without generalization there can be no reasoning, because you can always find outliers that disprove any claim.
I guess I was being a little tongue in cheek, but I’m mostly implying the discussion is not as simple as ‘hey this is really expensive, what about this cheaper alternative’. It’s a delicate thing because for many people it’s one of four things they probably dreamt about their whole life - marriage, ring, baby, house. There’s a lot of emotion behind all of it.
I’d love to be able to convince her that the ring money would do great in a Vanguard fund instead :p.
Edit: Looks like I have to put this disclaimer, for many people the things I listed above are milestones (not for all).
Well, you don't put emphasis on the price. I recently got my wife some diamond earrings. I would have bought her mined diamonds, but was considering lab produced stones. What is the difference? The difference is that lab stones are essentially "organic" diamonds - they cut out the suffering and corruption (pesticides) from the production of something nice. She liked the idea of getting a product that is part of an ethical supply chain. I enjoyed getting a nicer stones for half the price.
Dude, I had to talk my now-husband down from dropping two months' pay on a pretty sparkly. I’m so glad he didn’t surprise me with one - we were able to get something that I love wearing and feel less self-conscious about.
Suggested spending guideline: if you’re well off, spend about what you would on what you’d consider to be a great but not ridiculous gaming rig on her engagement present, and make sure she wouldn’t rather have a great gaming rig, sewing machine, musical instrument, etc. than a ring.
Addendum: I was later upset when he sold all his stocks during the 2008 crash because he thought he’d need the cash for our wedding - the wedding my parents were happily paying for, because Texas. A little more communication on both our parts would have prevented that loss.
Have you ever seen moissanite? Its generally shinier and has more luster than a diamond. Some people in the know might be able tell by how much it gleams vs a diamond, but most people will just think you have a really awesome diamond. It's not a cubic zirconia
Serious answer: have you discussed it with her? If you have talked it over and the major purchase of the engagement ring is something the two of you want to do then great, go for it. But it may be that the right decision for you is to think about alternate uses for the money.
Deciding to get married is wonderful. Congratulations! But sometimes people have a mental image of the sitcom scene where the one partner astounds the other by suddenly getting on one knee and plunking $30K on their hand. On reflection, that may not be the right way for people to start their life together, is all I'm saying.
I did the ring/knee thing once. In retrospect, was a mistake.
A true life partner will want to choose their own ring, and in particular, will want to think rationally about all of the other things you could do together with that money.
If I may interject, discussing potential surprises like this will kill the mood and ruin your big reveal later. So unless you’re sure your partner will take it well, I suggest not discussing things like this do just do as you please.
Some other friendly tips: you can secretly measure your partner’s finger size to get the perfect ring without them suspecting.
Going through the effort of getting the ring and sizing it properly without them suspecting shows how much you care and will yield you a better outcome than discussing this matter directly with them ;)
Edit: this is obviously with the assumption that you’ve at decided to get married. The surprise is about the ring not the marriage.
I would strongly advise against proposing in 2020 to someone you haven't discussed the prospects of marriage with.
It can be a romantic outing in and of itself. I took my wife ring shopping to a half dozen stores in a beautiful fall afternoon. We didn't but anything, that was never the plan. I just wanted to see what rings made her face light up, then I made a much cheaper purchase on my own time.
If I may interject, no surprise with stakes that high is actually worth the downside risk. Just communicate. Unless you're sure your partner would have agreed that the surprise was worth not communicating, I suggest discussing things like this.
Some care. I'd be pissed if my partner blew 30k on a few grams of carbon that frankly looks like cut glass unless you shove your face into it. I'd rather be handed a box with a loop of string, a symbolic offer to go ring shopping together.
The general advice that I've heard (and which I agree with) is that when you propose should be the big surprise/reveal, not that you're proposing.
It seems to be best if both partners have discussed and agreed on marriage prior to the actual proposal, and it would then make sense to also have discussed the kind of ring (or price class of ring at least) that they would want.
Exactly what ring you get can be a surprise of course, but I think the price tag should be somewhat known beforehand.
I guess so, but your idea of a proposal is different than mine. If the partners have discussed and agreed to get married then I'd say the proposal has already passed. But whatever makes folks happy is OK with me.
The pre-proposal discussion is probably more of a "think we should get married someday?" kind of thing, the actual proposal (and consequent concrete plans to get married) might not be until months/years later.
> You should ask your married friends what a proposal is
If by "you" you mean me, I've been married since 86. (I understand that you may have meant a generic "you.")
FWIW, we didn't buy a ring. I can't say we took that money and put it to use X but in the first years of marriage we certainly had some months where we were only able to pay bills by looking under the couch cushions for quarters, so I think it was a sound direction, for us.
I was proposed to via mindmap, essentially. Only fly in the ointment was that, as a German, he didn’t realize that greeting me with “we need to talk” set my mind in a completely different direction, but aside from that, seeing his thinking behind his long-term hopes for our relationship was quite romantic.
Looking for the stone together was entertaining after I was able to get him to understand that I really, really didn’t expect him to spend the “two months' salary” that is “customary” in my home country (USA).
If you want the romantic surprise, arrange a nice, private dinner (or other private special occasion) and get a silver CZ ring to present as a placeholder for the ring she’s going to help you pick out, making it clear that it’s a placeholder. If this does not go over well, better to find this out about her before making a big legal commitment!
A serious and somewhat foolproof answer that should work for most reasonable couples: Buy her a simple silver or gold ring when you propose. This shows commitment, and both silver and gold jewelry hold value far better than diamonds.
After proposing, you have several options:
* If she wants a diamond or moissanite or CZ or other ring, the two of you can go shopping for it later, or commission a custom one.
* If she doesn't want an expensive ring, you can spend it on other things.
* If she gets extremely upset and refuses just because you should have gotten a diamond ring the first time, you might want to rethink whether you want to spend your life with this person.
Finding a life partner is not easy. I suggest not adding "must be ok without a diamond ring" to your criteria. Also, communicate beforehand rather than taking a stand on an issue she will literally wear for life and expecting her to accede.
I say this as someone who likes the idea of moissanite, but relented to getting an "ethical" diamond from Canada (there is some dispute about provenance of these diamonds).
Buy a synthetic diamond instead. De Beers is the worst, they artificially limit supply and spread misinformation about synthetic diamonds to protect their interests.
I would say that diamonds as jewellry is a bad idea in general; it is artificially scarce, can be developed in a lab in a more perfect way (in fact, "too perfect" is how jewellers know a diamond has been created artificially) and doesn't shimmer as much as other stones.
I would instead look at Moissanite[0]; looks better, holds it's value a little bit better although debeers has killed a second hand market for this kind of jewellry..
No, because they never go on sale. They're stockpiled to preserve artificial market scarcity, instead of degrading the perceived value of the product by discounting it.
Artificial diamonds are amazing more perfect in clarity and colour. Though because they target a more budget market, i’d buy a 1ct artificial stone and take it to a jeweller to set in a one of a kind ring made with platinum, gold, etc. I think you’ll still have enough cash for a small car or a long holiday.
I got a Diamond Foundry one for my wife. Incredible clarity, cut, and quality. Probably 2/3 the price of comparable “real” diamond but without all that pesky diamond mine slavery, corruption, and monopolization. Wife liked it MORE because it wasn’t a “blood diamond.”