[smcl]

It looks like it dies down shortly afterwards but the next day someone gets unblocked ...

00:09, 23 February 2006‎ Tykell talk contribs‎ 11,705 bytes -1‎ No, we can't. Don't you know when to quit, kid? undo

23:42, 22 February 2006‎ Alex 101 talk contribs‎ 11,706 bytes +1‎ now that I'm unblocked and this page is unprotected we can change it undo

I think if you're all-caps screaming you've lost the argument, and seeing this I'm actually quite embarrassed for the guy. Personally I think "$band is good" or "$team is winning" does sound a bit silly, but I've seen it so many times that I'm kinda used to it. Besides I suspect the same is true for an American hearing "$band are good" or "$team are winning". Either way it definitely doesn't warrant losing your cool like this.

[zelos]

Especially as usage in British English isn't clear cut anyway. It depends on whether you're referring to the band as a singular object, or as a collective (https://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/learningenglish/grammar/l...)

[mumblemumble]

The same is true of US English as well, and people will choose one or the other when they're trying to emphasize one perspective or the other.

In my neck of the woods at least, whether the proper noun itself is a plural word is also a major factor. I would be more likely to say, "The Beatles are a band," but, "Led Zepplein is a band."

Angels & Airwaves is a fun one, because it's two different proper nouns, but "Angels & Airwaves is a band" still sounds more correct to my (Chicago) ears. I cannot provide any plausible-sounding rationalization for this opinion, but I will fight to the death to defend it.

[entropicdrifter]

Yeah, agreed. It's about context. I tend to use plural form even though I'm from the States too. That said, "Angels & Airwaves is a band" sounds more correct simply because it delineates the two proper (plural) nouns as a single (collective) entity very clearly.

Just like you'd say "Wells Fargo is a bank" even though it's obviously a huge corporation that is made up of thousands of people.

In some contexts it still makes way more sense to use the plural conjugations, like if you were to say "Angels & Airwaves are playing a great show", because at that point you're talking about what they (the band members) are doing. Likewise you would say "Angels & Airwaves are putting out an album" or "are retiring" because you're talking about the actions of the band members, as opposed to the business entity (the band itself).

Sorry, I'm a musician as well as a coder, so I've thought about the syntax of this before.

[mumblemumble]

I suppose I like "Angels & Airwaves is a band" because the alternative feels ambiguous in a way that creates tension. With "Angels & Airwaves are a band", I'm left wondering if that was the intended sense, or if they made some editing error and what was really meant is, "Angels & Airwaves is a band," or, "Angels & Airwaves are bands."

[nindalf]

I think the difference in is/are also reflected in the names of sports teams.

It sounds normal to say that an American team like Lakers/Patriots/Giants are winning while a British team like Arsenal/United/City is winning.

[smcl]

This is in danger of running into the back/forth that we saw in the Angels and Airwaves Wikipedia page :-)

Joking aside, it might sound odd to an American (or Canadian?) but British English would not distinguish between whether or not the name or “nickname” are singular or plural. So we would say:

The Seahawks are winning

Seattle are winning

Arsenal are winning

Rangers were relegated

I think this is the kind of thing where you can learn to tolerate the “wrong” one but it’ll always sound weird to you, whether “wrong” for you is British or US English :-)

Edit: I did think of a situation where we’d use “is” - when you’re referring to the legal entity or FULL name of the club. “Aberdeen Football Club is a Scottish professional football club based in Aberdeen”. This is pretty rare to see, and you’ll likely just see it in, ironically enough, the first line of a Wikipedia page.

[nwallin]

"The" and the postscripted "s" imply plurality, and therefore the use of "are". Nearly all sports teams in the US are pluralized, so it would be "the Seahawks", "the Bears" etc. There are a small handful of counter exactly examples, such as the Utah Jazz and the Miami Heat. But I think most sports fans use their standard sports lexicon that they use for every other team and treat team names as plurals.

Band names tend to be mixed. It's clearly "the Red Hot Chili Peppers are playing at..." but also "Primus is playing at...". (See also the edit war between "The Eagles" and just "Eagles")

[SAI_Peregrinus]

I think the use of "The" as part of the name also matters.

"The Patriots are winning" sounds OK to me as an American. "The Patriots is winning" sounds totally wrong. "Arsenal are winning" sounds fine, "Arsenal is winning" also sounds fine.

[ghaff]

When I think of American sports teams there's usually an understood "The" in front. "Patriots are winning" works fine conversationally but, if you were being a bit more formal or writing it down, you'd say "The Patriots are winning." On the other hand, the city name is singular. "Boston is winning."

[Plyphon_]

I'm not sure, I'd never 'Saints is winning'. 'Saints are winning' sounds correct, though. Even 'Arsenal is winning' sounds a bit wrong.

Whos winning? Arsenal are (team)

Whos winning? Ronnie O'Sullivan is (singular)

Disclosure: I am English.

[7777fps]

Exactly, I think grammatically this would be correct:

Arsenal are winning

Arsenal is the best team in the league

It's contradictory (as well as plainly false ;) ), but that's English.

[DanBC]

Lots of people who speak English as a first language would say "Arsenal are the best team" or "arsenal are the best club".

https://twitter.com/search?q=%22arsenal%20are%20the%20best%2...

[7777fps]

Well yeah, either is fine.

[Noos]

No, this is incorrect.

Something that comprises many people is treated as singular unless it's in a plural form.

-Arsenal is a team. -We are Arsenal players.

-There are many arsenals in Britain, but there is only one Arsenal.

If it's unclear you have to add words. You have to make sure the subject is singular. With Arsenal the singular nature of the word doesn't require it.

-There are many patriots in the USA, but there is only one Patriots football team.

In your example, Arsenal is the singular team. "Arsenal players are winning" is grammatically correct but not really used because players are understood to be part of a team.

[zaphirplane]

Your “are” examples refer to a team ending in S and the “is” examples don’t.

perhaps why it sounds right

[raverbashing]

Makes sense. Though it seems that maybe the sports teams are (mostly) pluralized in the US?

From memory NBA, NFL, MLB use pluralized names but MLS and Indy Car Racing (or whatever it is called now) doesn't?

[KMag]

The difference is that most U.S. sports teams names are proper nouns in the plural form (49ers, Raiders, etc.), but most motor sports teams are usually referred to as Team <Singlular Noun>. "Team Quaker State is in the lead." If they were the Quaker States, then it would be "Quaker States are in the lead."

I don't follow MLS, but looking at the team names, they mostly look singular to me, apart from "New York Red Bulls". I suspect the Red Bulls are nearly always referred to in the plural by Americans.

[dwighttk]

Not all NBA

E.g. Jazz, Heat, Thunder