[audition]

I'd start with a movie, not a book. The movie is "Game Changers", directed by James Cameron, and released last month on Netflix and Amazon Video. If you're skeptical about the science behind the movie, read the critique published in Men's Health magazine along with the rebuttal from one of the MD's interviewed in the film.

Next I'd read "The Engine 2 seven-day rescue diet" by Rip Esselstyn. If you a more in-depth treatment, try "How Not to Die" by Michael Greger, MD. If you want scientific journal articles, I recommend the work of Caldwell Esselstyn. MD and Dean Ornish, MD. Dean Ornish's TED talk is also a good reference.

[jjeaff]

I really liked game changers, but a few things stuck out to me, the first was the visual they used where they compared blood after a meal with meat vs a meal without meat. They put all this emphasis on how cloudy the blood plasma was in the blood taken after a meaty meal. They didn't explain why that was bad and I couldn't find any information elsewhere on why or even if that is a bad thing. Perhaps cloudy plasma is better?

Second, I found it very dishonest that great pains were taken to show that many advocates and studies of Paleo and other meat based diets were merely the product of bias because "big meat" was influencing them financially. I then discovered that James Cameron and his wife own a pea protein company. Which is one of the main ingredients in meat free "meat". Hmm, they wouldn't stand to gain financially from people going vegan, would they?

Normally, I wouldn't think that would matter too much. But they didn't disclose that and sounds a lot like the pot calling the kettle black.

I think science is pretty settled that we should all have a higher ratio of vegetables in our diet. But humans are unquestionably omnivores so I think Game Changers advocating for a totally animal product free diet is worried more about their ideology and possibly pocketbooks than they are the health of those who watch.

[coolswan]

A bunch of people debunking the movie, e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NV8RVKX-ues

[audition]

Fun fact - the most popular subject for debates in the original Coursera course "How to Reason and Argue" was diet. We've got a lively debate going here in the comments below - bravo!

I myself am most interested in what medical doctors (MD's) have to say about the question of plant-based diets, with reference to peer reviewed scientific journal articles. On the one hand, we've got high-profile MD's such as Dean Ornish, Caldwell Esselstyn, Michael Greger, Neal Barnard, Joel Fuhrman, James Lomis and Matthew Lederman arguing for the benefits of a plant-based diet. Can someone provide links to MD's who take an opposing view?

[muzani]

I saw Game Changers too. I liked the message, and as someone who built a business on keto, it was an interesting perspective.

But quick research on Google Scholar points out that it's probably hiding some facts. Like vegans may be healthier but get obese too. It helps with diabetes and insulin resistance, but not completely. Gladiators may have been a little fat, as a form of armor.

What's interesting is a quick search turns out that lacto ovo vegetarians do a little better than vegans. So "animal products" might not be entirely bad.

[tcbasche]

Skeptical about the science? You mean the lack thereof?

They do a once off 'experiment' with a sample size of 3 and claim that it's conclusive evidence that eating meat "is bad". Yikes.

[raspasov]

It is not directed by James Cameron, he's just one of the people who gave money for it (aka producers). And I'm sorry for the strong language, but the movie is absolute garbage as far as science is concerned. One-sided, one-liner "summaries" of studies, very heavy on examples that have nothing to do with science or proper research (aka vegetarian fighter beats meat-eating one, vegetarian strongman sets records, etc etc).

You can watch the debate on Joe Rogan and draw your own conclusions https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0zgNY_kqlI . The only thing I can equate the director of that movie is Donald Trump, a total demagogue.