[emsimot]

1. I don't know if it will work, but the idea is Proof of Stake (ETH2 in Ethereum-land)

2. You can't -- this is a cultural problem, not a technological one

3. There's no such thing as money laundering

4. Peer-to-peer, transparent finance infrastructure

5. User-money as a layer on top of cryptocurrency

[CaptainZapp]

There's no such thing as money laundering

This, on its face, is a pretty outrageous assertion.

I think if you throw a statement like this into the discussion I'm sure you don't mind if I demand that you prove it.

[emsimot]

My apologies, I shouldn't treat HN like Twitter. My statement was meant to spark a discussion but I should try to explain myself.

Maybe "Money laundering doesn't exist in a hypothetical world of private peer-to-peer transactions" is better? That's what I believe the crypto-folk are working towards.

I recognize the existence of laws again 'money laundering' in countries like the USA. I suppose a better way of framing what I think is that money laundering is an invented crime in order to further empower agents of a State to seize assets of those suspected of actual crimes. By 'invented' and 'actual' I'm appealing to a sense of legitimacy separate (or adjacent?) to said State's legal system.

[arcticbull]

> 1. Proof of stake.

This has yet to be proven, and as you say, there’s reasons why it has yet to land. I give this one vitaliks sideways smiley face.

> 2. You can't -- this is a cultural problem, not a technological one

Uh, one that doesn’t exist in the current financial system. I’m sure y’all will find a way. As I said, it’s a prerequisite.

> 3. There’s no such thing as money laundering.

Hilarious. I see someone never took compliance training at work. With that attitude I’d love to see you explain your position to a judge. Money laundering is literally financial transactions arranged in such a way as to conceal the original source of funds.

> 4. Buzzword soup.

> 5. More buzzword soup.

More buzzword soup that immediately falls down as once you use crypto as only a bulk transport instrument you’ve lost out on all its ostensible benefits. No transparency, no security, it’s no better than just using a wire transfer.

[weego]

Hilarious. I see someone never took compliance training at work. With that attitude I’d love to see you explain your position to a judge. Money laundering is literally financial transactions arranged in such a way as to conceal the original source of funds.

I though anonymity and legal safeharbour were founding principles of cryptocurrency? The original comment is correct that what we call money laundering is an artificial construct of power.

[realusername]

> Uh, one that doesn’t exist in the current financial system. I’m sure y’all will find a way. As I said, it’s a prerequisite.

Is that sarcasm? How do you think criminal groups get funded? They use the financial system like anybody else. You should have a look into the history of HSBC, money laundering and financing drug cartels is one of their main specialty.

[emsimot]

> 4. Buzzword soup

Maybe I'm in too deep but peer-to-peer is a buzzword? I mean person-to-person, without intermediaries. This seems useful and powerful to me (and my politics I suppose).

> 5. no transparency/security using crypto as bulk transport

I don't mean building a social layer on top, I mean building digital infrastructure on top, 'smart contracts' etc.

I still maintain hope for something like this but after watching the gradual but massive increase in the complexity of 'DeFi' (decentrialized finance) in the Ethereum community I don't know where to look and what to work on these days...

[DennisP]

> 5. Currently in production

It's DAI, a stable currency based on derivatives, built on Ethereum and backed by ETH. It's not perfectly stable but it's done a reasonably good job keeping a value of one dollar, despite a 94% drop in the ETH price. Current DAI supply is $86 million.

[Shoue]

>This has yet to be proven, and as you say, there’s reasons why it has yet to land. I give this one vitaliks sideways smiley face.

Yeah, the hundreds of cryptocurrencies using it isn't enough.

[drcode]

Proof is stake has been running fine in production for a long time as part of the tendermint project.

[jki275]

ETH is never going to go POS. There's absolutely zero motivation to do it, and they just keep pushing it off into the future.

POS has been a solved problem for years. RDD did it back in the beginning. XTZ is a current working POS chain.