[prepend]

Google has implemented this asshole design/nagware in many products to push unnecessary to me and invasive data collection or functionality I want won’t be available.

For example, their maps app on iOS won’t save locations for me unless I sign in an enable web history tracking. I get prompted every time I try to save a pin as well as every once in a while I’m case I change my mind.

It’s a free app and it’s Google’s prerogative to try to get value out of it. But it’s annoying to me that they purposely don’t implement client tech (eg, save to app cache, device cookie not tied to individual) that would make their app better for me. And that they nag with no way to turn off forever. Their app already shows ads and makes money for them, they just want more money from the data stream.

I also worry about less savvy customers who don’t understand the prompt and unwittingly opt in to data collection that exists forever. The Facebook privacy explosion of last year is an example of users who accepted terms, but didn’t understand them, and got upset when data was used in ways that upset them.

[astral303]

I think Google Maps not saving your history as you described is an incredibly bad, frustrating experience.

FFS, my phone has gigs of RAM, why can’t Google Maps remember the address I searched for ten minutes ago? One minute ago? This is 2019. It has been this bad for a decade plus. Embarrassing IMO and demonstrates true UX myopia and true UX incompetence.

[SamuelAdams]

Personally I switched to Apple Maps after the iOS 13 release and haven't looked back. Because it's integrated into the OS, Apple Maps can look into your messages and auto-complete addresses from that. It can also save places without you signing into an account.

The only thing I miss is google's "offline" mode. I live in Michigan, and I frequently go on trips up north into heavily wooded areas. I don't always get cell service, so being able to save map data locally is a huge benefit. I can still search for nearby gas stations or stores even if I do not have cell service.

From what I tried, there's no way to save data in Apple Maps - it assumes the device is always connected to the internet.

[DHPersonal]

HERE WeGo has an offline version. https://apps.apple.com/us/app/here-wego-city-navigation/id95...

[Marsymars]

I would pay Apple a monthly fee to get Apple Maps on Android.

[jrobn]

I also nuked google maps from my iPhone after iOS 13.

I share your frustration.

[wlesieutre]

Normally I'd say "never attribute to malice that which can be explained by incompetence," but I really do think Google could fix this if they wanted to.

It still sucks because they don't want to fix it. Google makes their money off of people giving up info for ad targeting, and a user who only contributes one or two manually saved locations probably costs them more than they stand to gain.

[zenography]

Occam's razor also needs to be applied. If the explanation involving malice is the simpler option that makes fewer assumptions, then it is more likely.

[astral303]

I bet this has been discussed internally, but nobody cares because they don’t care about UX enough. They don’t understand the impact. The internal organization is fractured into fiefdoms defending internal services (e.g. deployment, AMP) and defending layers (e.g. SRE department), with nobody left responsible for the complete, vertically integrated user experience.

To me, this is a simpler explanation than malice.

[mackrevinack]

I started using openstreetmap 3 years ago now and I hadn't had to use Google maps since. unfortunately not everyone else might have the same luck. it really depends on whether there are mappers in your area or have been in the past.

only way to know would be to download osmAnd and find out. it's a good all rounder app. for navigation i tend to use maps.me

[velosol]

Back in the Lollipop, maybe even KitKat days the maps app would save searches locally without web & app activity on similar to how the current gmail app keeps the last few searches locally even when you have web & app activity turned off in your profile.

[prepend]

Similarly, I wish Google.com wouldn’t prompt me about how awesome chrome is every time I visit and not logged in. At least with this, I can just keep a chrome instance for only google products. So I stayed logged in, but it’s not of my real web usage.

[throwaheyy]

That kind of user-hostile bullshit is why I avoid anything and everything associated with Google. Still use search, but trying to break that habit.

[indigochill]

I gotta be that guy and recommend DuckDuckGo. No, it's not always as good as Google search, but it's still usually good enough and when you -really- need Google you can simply add "g!". Every other time, you can rest assured your searches aren't feeding some AI.

DDG is at least a reasonable way to ween yourself off Google search rather than needing to go full cold turkey.

[nvrspyx]

As I always do when this is suggested, I recommend using “!s” for Startpage instead of “!g” for Google.

Similar to DDG, Startpage provides results in a privacy respecting way, but it uses Google instead of Bing (and Oath), which DDG uses. There’s a common misconception amongst some that using !g on DDG is private, but it’s just a redirect, so Google can gather information from that search. Using !s as the fallback instead will keep your searches private.

[fauigerzigerk]

I don't understand the business model of Startpage. They pay Google for using their search engine. Their revenue comes from non-personalised advertising.

So that means either Startpage has higher ad margins than Google or Google is selling services to Startpage below their own search margins or Startpage has some other source of funds to subsidise the search engine.

[brewdad]

They do have a freemium mail offering

https://www.startmail.com/en/

I have no idea how much revenue this may bring in but it can't be much since I don't think I've ever seen it recommended in an Ask HN thread.

[Marsymars]

> or Google is selling services to Startpage below their own search margins

I expect this is the case - it's still better for Google to capture a user at lower margins via Startpage than to lose them to Bing.

[indigochill]

Awesome, I didn't actually know about that option. Will try that now instead.

I do find the mention of DDG using Oath rather alarming, though, since Oath seems particularly obnoxious, at least with their GDPR pop-up on Tumblr. What does DDG do with Oath?

[nvrspyx]

Let me correct myself: Oath (formerly Yahoo) and Bing. However, that's still not right. It's now Verizon Media (formerly Yahoo) and Bing, not Oath.

DDG was originally using Yahoo and Bing. Yahoo was thrown under the Oath umbrella along with AOL, Tumblr, Engadget, etc. when they were acquired by Verizon. I assume for transparency, DDG stated they use "Oath (formerly Yahoo) and Bing" on their Sources help page to indicate who they're actually making the deal with.[0] However, I guess Verizon has changed the Oath name to Verizon Media, so now it's "Verizon Media (formerly Yahoo) and Bing".

But, to answer your question. It's just a long winded way of saying Yahoo.

[0]: https://help.duckduckgo.com/duckduckgo-help-pages/results/so...

[krageon]

I moved to DuckDuckGo and I'm not going to lie, I hate it. I've been using it almost exclusively for a few months now and what it has definitely done is lower my impulse to search for things. Perhaps that is what you are after, in which case definitely try it.

[pteraspidomorph]

If you use duckduckgo, in the situations in which you think the results are inadequate you can fall back on google by appending !g to the end of your search.

[molmalo]

What about youtube app asking every time to suscribe to youtube premium? I say no, then after a while I'm asked again.

Seriously, I already said no 100s of times, why keep asking?

[Kaiyou]

What else can you use, though? DuckDuckGo tracks you too, they're just lying about it, which is imho worse. Don't have the links handy right now, but it should be searchable. Alternatively, don't trust me.

[AJ007]

They’ve done the same to AdWords and Adsense. I have messages that have been showing for years now and won’t go away.

[CaptainZapp]

Have yo tried maps.me on IOS?

I can't speak for their privacy practices, but it has the bifg advantage of letting you download maps to use them off-line.

[brewdad]

Maps.me is my go to app when traveling in a foreign country where I may not have cell service. At home, in my car, I often need traffic info more than I need to know how to reach my destination. Is there a privacy respecting app that can deliver that?

[tomcatfish]

The weirdest thing to me is that the data is still there and is still accessible. Google Maps won't remember my "Home" and "Work" locations, but when the device is in airplane mode, it will show the GPS coordinates of both (although they were "forgotten" several devices ago, and this phone has no way of knowing about them)

[barrkel]

I use separate accounts for Google Maps vs Web Search.