[jorawebdev]

Other than having “Google” on my resume there is nothing special or applicable outside of Google. Most tools are internal, isolated and the choices are restrictive. Management is shitty - micro-management is in full bloom, display lack of management knowledge, skills and there’s plenty of abuse of power. They don’t show their appreciation to what we do. All developers are very competitive. My entire time of over a year in 2 different teams is spent in isolation and self learning without much help or directions. I’m currently actively interviewing outside.

[kyrra]

As someone who has worked at multiple companies, currently at Google, you don't tend to leave a company, you leave a manager. Managers are one of your primary interfaces to a company. If those managers are crap, you will have a bad experience.

[scottlegrand2]

It's bigger than that IMO. I can switch managers at a big company. But if the entire division is inept, it's time to jump companies because it's a tell that the culture is decaying.

For me, the only reason I will never go back to GOOG is blind allocation. IMO that's a bug, not a feature.

[lreeves]

What is blind allocation and why is it bad?

[Zach_the_Lizard]

I'm guessing here, but I think this is referring to when a new hire cannot choose the team he or she is joining.

Google et al often do general hiring. This means that they hire you and then later decide where to assign you afterwards.

I had thought at Google hiring managers could bid on you and some kind of choice could be made. But maybe that's only in big enough offices with good enough resumes.

It's bad because you don't know which team you're joining and the quality of the manager. It's good because it lets the company assign you to the most important areas first.

Contrast this with a normal process where the hiring manager for the team you're joining is in the interview loop. You know ahead of time which team you're joining.

[jogjayr]

I don't think this happens at Google anymore. I knew what team I was joining, and spoke with the manager, before signing my offer. I've been asked to do phone calls/lunches with prospective new hires to sell them on our team. Everyone who started on the team after me told me they spoke with multiple teams before signing on.

[cbanek]

My experience was that while you might get to talk to your manager before accepting, you don't get to interview with the team you will be working on.

That hugely slants the purpose of the interview toward Google, as the candidate really has no idea who they will be working with, or how they think. The interview should go both ways and provide information to both sides on if it's a good fit, but at Google, they go only one way.

This might be a small point for most, but for minority candidates, knowing who you will be working with and having confidence they won't actively cause you grief is a big sticking point. At least it was for me (I turned them down).

[rco8786]

What’s blind allocation?

[opportune]

I don’t really agree with this, most of my decisions regarding moving companies have been motivated primarily by money/tech/location rather than my manager. And I assume it’s similar for many others. Plenty of people leave google to work at places with similarly good perks but better pay even if they have no issues with their manager

[wolco]

How can you have micro-management and isolation?

[D-Coder]

They ignore you for weeks, then complain about every line of code and solution you've produced and tell you how you should have done it. Repeat every month or two until crazy.

[wolco]

Complaining at the end is a different problem that gets solved during the requirements phase. They are not micro-managing your day but the end results against expectations.

[oscargrouch]

Maybe the micro-management is not micro-managing what you think they should be micro-managing?

I mean, thats the problem with vertical schemes and bureocracy.. the guy who is micro-managing is also micro-managed by some sort of results that actually ends not being very pragmatic, end give him good points in this blind objective system who ranks him and the people he manage according to some parameters that in the end they 'game' to look good.

[jorawebdev]

They manager just blindly follows the policies, like a dumb decoupled code. He's as guilty as his superior and the entire system.

[oscargrouch]

Thats the problem with people beeing forced to game ranking systems in order to advance starting from their childhood.

Of course we want to fight the impermanence, but we should not create a bubble to feel safe inside of it as a virtual environment with rules that doesnt change, just because we miss the peace in the maternal woomb.

The impermanence and uncertainty is a reality, we should not fight in order to avoid it by being alienated of its nature, but to use our science, math and tools after all to understand it, and to navigate better through it.

The XXI century requires a deep change in our philosophical disposition and culture.

Its not just about Google, the corporate culture of Google is a side effect of our culture as anything else that grows inside of it.

But the rigid schemes are a clear sign that it will stop innovating more and more with time as the old startup status-quo defying spirit is completely gone.

[jorawebdev]

micro-management dictated by the company with their policies and promoting to management those who lack basic management skills. Isolation is based on the culture of competitiveness, self-centered goals, ignorance and, again, lack of necessary management skills in understanding by removing blockers, offering help... etc

[bubersson]

This sounds like a really bad experience. Another completely different team and manager may be a day and night difference. For example there are many Google projects that work directly in open-source being led by folks that are the top of the given field, so worth checking out.

But yea, things are not always rosy and maybe Google indeed isn't the right fit.

[aalhour]

What do you think are the best abstractions, mind models and technologies you learned at Google? I read somewhere about SSTables and several other topics related to writing distributed systems, can you share your take on this?

[mav3rick]

You can easily switch teams.

[jorawebdev]

Being a TVC (contractor) this option is close to impossible, as I would need to go through a typical 5+ rounds of interview process - the same as for outsiders. This is a different discussion, however, and this process is completely broken, unfair, discouraging and illogical even for Google. My main point in answering the question was around restrictions to, mainly, house-brewed tech stack and overall attitude of other developers I had a chance to work with.

[mav3rick]

Sorry the TVC experience is nowhere close to the full Googler experience.

[alephnan]

We’re you a TVC or a full time employee?

[jorawebdev]

I'm still a TVC. This could be a separate discussion on the scope of how TVCs are treated and it could complement all the recent articles in the media, however, my main focus was on something common, such as tech stack, restrictions and constrictions that will impact you when you go out and work somewhere else.

[mav3rick]

TVCs get many of the same perks full time Googlers do. You can always interview if you want to be a full time.