Ask HN: I'm a New Manager – How to Best Handle Employee Grievance?

[dvanwag]

I was recently hired as a Project Manager at a small company. I've only been on the job a few weeks when I was told an employee had filed a complaint against me for creating a hostile workplace. When I asked how I exactly did this I was told I said a curse word at a meeting.

Has anyone ever dealt with this situation before? What is the best thing for me to do? I dont want a hostile workplace environment on my end where I have to keep looking over my shoulder either.

[CyberFonic]

I have been a project manager in many organisations and I have on occasion let loose swear words. It has never been a problem. Over the years I have noticed that there are two distinct possibilities:

1. You might be in a company where nobody swears. In that case, it might be the expected norm that you too speak diplomatically and politely.

2. You might have a precious snowflake on your team. These come in two varieties:

(a) persons who simply are simply more sensitive than the majority; and

(b) persons who are under-performing and are using the excuse of "hostile workplace" as a cover-up for their substandard productivity.

Perhaps, you are the first project manager that they have hired and the staff are not accustomed to being expected to deliver on schedule, etc. In a small company, it seems strange to me that you can't have a candid conversation with your manager / boss. Not being given the individual's name for "privacy reasons" seems suspiciously like somebody is playing politics.

[danielscrubs]

So true, I've met all of them during my decade of work! But I've had one instance when the project manager was the snowflake.

The manager needed constant validation, and when he didn't get it he became angry. Last time, half the team just left within a year. What I've gathered is that more often than not, they are micro managers with some kind of broken confidence (bad divorce, bad education or bad health can all take its toll on it). "If people just listened to me..." is their motto, no matter who they talk to or what subject. When other teams down-prioritised our team because they didn't want to work with him it was shit flinging time!

I'm starting to get better at sensing if people just want to win a discussion or want to learn & teach. But I wished I learnt it sooner.

[peterangular]

> I'm starting to get better at sensing if people just want to win a discussion or want to learn & teach. But I wished I learnt it sooner.

The older I get the more I see this as a _critical_ soft skill to have in the corporate world. I wish I could go back to myself in earlier engineering roles and say, "just stop talking - these people don't care, they're only here for the narrative."

[go_ruby]

If it was actually only a single curse word and not maliciously directed at any individual, apologize and start recording the meetings, you probably have your phone out anyway, download the Hi Q app, just let it run. That person probably has something to hide about their work habits. You don't have to trot out the recordings at the first sign of back stabbing, let them pile up and if they make a serious play to get you canned you can start to share them at an advantageous moment. I learned this the hard way. I started keeping my phone in my breast pocket if there was not a table to set it on, people who make those sort of HR reports always have something to hide or protect usually their own incompetence. You may never need them but it literally can't hurt.

[underwater]

I believe that is illegal in certain countries and states. For example California has two party consent for recording conversations.

[testvox]

In California it would not be illegal so long as all parties were warned they were being recorded, but what he describes is illegal unless they are in a one party consent state.

> (a) A person who, intentionally and without the consent of all parties to a confidential communication, uses an electronic amplifying or recording device to eavesdrop upon or record the confidential communication, whether the communication is carried on among the parties in the presence of one another or by means of a telegraph, telephone, or other device, except a radio, shall be punished...

(b) For the purposes of this section, “person” means an individual, business association, partnership, corporation, limited liability company, or other legal entity, and an individual acting or purporting to act for or on behalf of any government or subdivision thereof, whether federal, state, or local, but excludes an individual known by all parties to a confidential communication to be overhearing or recording the communication.

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySectio...

[notus]

The way they are doing it seems illegal... However at my work we host all our meetings through zoom and record them all.

[ahaferburg]

That also sounds illegal.

[eropple]

Can you maybe substantiate this a little? I don't understand why a company recording the meetings of their employees, on company time and regarding company business, would be illegal.

(An individual doing so, on the other hand, might be problematic.)

[NewsAware]

This would definitely be illegal in Germany where I work as CTO. Even having employees sign some letter of acceptance of such would still be illegal as a court would assume an employee was in an uneven power position and therefore not able to refuse even if they wanted to.

[notus]

Maybe if they were secretly recording but its common knowledge they are all recorded so people can refer back to them if necessary.

[ahaferburg]

That sounds illegal.

[downrightmike]

There are US states that have traditionally been home to call centers, and the laws in those states usually allow for only consent of one party to record, including yourself.

[annogram]

Depends where for most places it's not Illegal it's just inadmissible in court.

[mancerayder]

It depends the context in which you cursed. As a curser (and manager), it's taken much worse in certain circumstances. I.e. "This fucking code" versus "I don't give a fuck what you have to say" or such, in the latter is more aggressive and directed.

An environment where cursing is a fireable offense is an environment I'd avoid, because there are limits to the demands of hypersensitive people.

Cursing aside, my worry is your hostile environment criticism might have a wider cause than a single word. Try to work on building positive relationships with as many people as possible. Smalltalk, interest in them and help in the context of the company are things to aim to build.

[JSeymourATL]

> I was told an employee had filed a complaint ...

Assuming the Company is large enough to have an HR Department; expect them to conduct an investigation. Their primary role is to protect the company.

As a Manager-- you'll want to align yourself with HR (be politically savvy) seek their guidance and consider the needs of the broader organization first.

Understand that lots of people are watching you now. You'll need to be extra courteous and thoughtful in your words and actions.

> https://www.employersresource.com/human-resources/hr-scenari...

[Trias11]

+1

Talk to HR, discuss this in details.

HR would be on your side (and not on the employee side - even though he/she may be told otherwise).

So HR may propose good plan to resolve it.

[maddy1512]

In my opinion you should not curse as a manager in a serious meeting.

For eg: "The quality of this code can be improved" vs "This fucking code has to be corrected" or

very simple statements like:

"what is this"? vs "what the fuck is this"

The tone by adding one curse word changes from inquisitive to condescending and intimidating.

So never use curse words for serious things.

However, after a certain period of time when you're familiar with the environment and people you may joke and curse while having a casual chit-chat.

As for the problem now, as this is a small company have an informal meeting and sort this out and apologize if needed(use humor if you're good at it to make all this less uncomfortable)!

[duxup]

So where does it go from here? If anywhere?

What happens next really depends on your employer. If they don't think it was a problem, then you are probably good.

If your employer feels there is a problem then ask your employer what happens next (well ask either way and getting the response in email is nice).

I had a coworker complain to HR about me, but it was also a part of a campaign to file complaints against a laundry list of people and my employer did not feel the complaints were valid. They were very minor complaints that didn't even make sense on the most basic level (like misnamed me several times, identified me as someone else, identified tasks I wasn't even responsible for, and then they would say I helped them with the things they previously complained about).

I was very clear with HR about things. Followed up with an email to HR to get what I said in writing.

Then I was just very careful around that employee, emails were very clear and detailed, I did everything I could to not be alone with that person.

Eventually that employee left, tried to sue the company (for entirely new claims unrelated to me), had case thrown out and it was ok from there.

But every company is different so who knows what might happen.

If you feel things start to get confused... contact a lawyer who can give you advice. Plenty of lawyers out there who can offer advice for free or cheaper for just a bit of their time.

Keep in mind only your own lawyer is there explicitly to help you and will have your best interests in mind.

No matter what your company says HR is there to protect the company, NOT you.

[sombremesa]

I'm not sure a project manager is the same thing as a manager. Is this person your direct report?

[dvanwag]

As far as I am aware. I was not given the individual's name for "privacy reasons". I was explicitly told it was someone under me, but that could be anyone of 20-some odd people.

[megablast]

You are a project manager. You have no one under you.

[amerkhalid]

A lot of project managers like to pretend that they are real managers. Some of them might even believe that developers are their reports.

[boohoojangles]

If he has no direct, on my past jobs, project managers were also expect to keep the head cooler than engs because they were facilitators and mediators.

[vogt]

In most cases, most certainly not. If the OP was hired as a managing PM with direct PM reports, that's a different story. It is unclear what the context is.

[ben_jones]

It's hard advice but especially at a small company with potentially no formal processes the best you can do is prepare for any outcome. As with all aspects of life, be kind, thoughtful, and reasonable, but do not always assume others will be the same to you.

[megablast]

> I dont want a hostile workplace environment on my end where I have to keep looking over my shoulder either.

But you don't care about creating a hostile workplace? At no point have you addressed what you have created.

[NewsAware]

If this is a small company, I would probably not worry too much about process and ask the concerned employee to discuss this in a friendly and open way. Maybe a misunderstanding which can be cleared, maybe the reason is actually lying deeper. Good chance you can resolve this by being emphatic and act understandingly.

That being said, I would note down a memory protocol afterwards in case this turns ugly after all.

[dvanwag]

I'm not sure what you mean by a memory protocol, what is that?

[Spooky23]

Sometimes they are called memorandum for the record.

Send yourself an email with your recollection of the incident and print a copy that you do not keep at work. If there is a problem later, you’ll have documentation of your contemporaneous thoughts that can be used to corroborate yourself.

It’s good practice whenever something significant happens.

[jason_slack]

Perhaps OP means to jot down some notes, with dates and times to remember what happened and when should this arise again.

[loco5niner]

Not cursing is more professional than cursing.

[Trias11]

If the guy barged into the new position from outside and cursed his way through meetings in aggressive way - that is one thing.

But if he used a "curse word" once (OMG!) in a meeting and some primadonna filed a complaint - fuck that.

[NullPrefix]

Have you tried not cursing?

[Trias11]

I did and it fucking worked!

[boohoojangles]

The easiest route.

[annogram]

Say that you want to record meeting minutes from now on and will be recording important meetings to summaries later. If people aren't comfortable with that ask them not to attend and they can be briefed later. Eventually, that will get to annoying and they will just start attending the meetings.