[robenkleene]

Yeah, but I'm not arguing whether developers exist who don't use the command line, of course they do. The question is simply whether the majority of programmers use the command line? I'm proposing that they do, unfortunately there's no available data for this point specifically, so we end up falling back to anecdote. But I am still super curious about your perspective on this. From what I've observed anecdotally, and from the most relevant data I've looked at, I'd guess the percentage of professional developers that rely on the command line is at least 80% (I am giving a lot of leeway for Microsoft-stack developers, which I'm not really familiar with, excluding developers using Microsoft technologies, I'd say well over 90% of professional developers rely on the command line). Do you disagree with these estimates? And if you don’t mind answering, where would you put the percent? (I'd also be super curious which technologies developers that don't use the command line are on.)

[pjmlp]

The thing you are missing that what UNIX devs rely on the command line for, is easily achievable by scripting, REPLs, and IDE integration.

For example I can do everything I need from Python or PowerShell from inside Visual Studio, just like Xerox PARC devs used to do with their REPLs on Lisp, Smalltalk and Mesa/Cedar workstations.

Naturally I am forced to drop down to old style command line every now and then, but that is forced upon me by tools I don't create, and most of the time they are ports from UNIX tooling.

[robenkleene]

Got it, yeah as long as we agree most programmers do use the command line. I actually agree that there are hypothetical ways a command line could almost always be replaced, but to me the important part is that most developers choose not to replace it. (And I’d argue that dependence on the command line is actually increasing overtime, with package management, version control, continuous integration, and modern editor features being implement on top of it.)

The question I pose then, is if these things are possible to do in other ways, and those other ways are better, why don't professional developers choose to use them? For example, why isn’t programming on an iPad popular? I.e., where these other methods are literally the only way to do programming on device? Using SSH to program entirely in a terminal is almost certainly more popular for professional developers than any other approach of programming on an iPad (using blog posts about how professional developers develop on an iPad as an indicator).

[pjmlp]

Because those blog posts are from UNIX devs trying to use iPads for UNIX like work.

This is how Apple devs actually do development on iPads.

- Swift Playgrounds

- Pythonista

- Continuous for C# and F#

- Lisping

- Raskell

- GLSL Studio

[robenkleene]

I’m only interested in whether the majority of professional developers are able to ship software to their users. Is your stance that you can do that just fine with just the tools you listed and therefore professional developers don’t need the command line on iOS?

[pjmlp]

I guess that I am not a professional developer, apparently.

[robenkleene]

Haha, not sure about that, but you most certainly aren't the "majority of professional developers". Neither am I, that's a whole bunch of people who couldn't care less about how you or I want to work.