[youeeeeeediot]

Elite universities have been more than complicit in this as well, especially when they can charge such a premium on "international student" tuition. It is also why they so often look the other way when those students bring their cultural values on things like cheating with them. No one dares admit it for fear of being labeled racist or xenophobic.

[msie]

"when those students bring their cultural values on things like cheating with them" - geez, I wonder why international students find it hard to assimilate.

[flukus]

Can't speak for the US but this is certainly the case in Australian Universities, I've had interns that don't speak enough English to order a hamburger yet somehow got masters degrees. Cheating is rampant and the Universities will look the other way, even threaten teachers that fail students. The industry has the legitimacy of a pyramid scheme and deserves to be shut down.

While they're here many students will also work more than the allowed 25 hours a week (meant for industry experience not ubereats) and for below minimum wage, which has a huge affect on the job market for younger people.

[alexmlamb]

Just to be clear, this doesn't necessarily mean that the students got the degree through fraud or low standards.

Speaking and listening can be harder than reading and writing, so the students might be doing good work even if their spoken language isn't very good. Also in technical subjects you might not need to know the language well to pass the tests and do the homeworks.

As an example, I have an Msc from a French language university, but I can't really understand the language.

[flukus]

> Just to be clear, this doesn't necessarily mean that the students got the degree through fraud or low standards.

From what I understand of the process there are meant to be English literacy tests for ESL students and I think most of them have a spoken component. It's not necessarily the students (some or even most of them would be the victims) but someone in the system certainly is certainly fraudulent.

As for technical competency of the ones I've worked with in the intern program, they're lucky we didn't get to select them because they wouldn't have passed the most basic coding test (simpler than fizzbuzz) in any language. It was much more than the practical vs theoretical divide too, as far as I could tell they were completely bereft of theoretical knowledge, even the basics of their masters specialties.