[muzani]

To each their own. I don't like Overwatch or games like Fallout simply because of the 1500 hours. I like to complete a game within a month or so. Much longer and it feels like work (work is fun too and if I'm going to get good at something, it should at least pay the bills).

My sweet spot would actually be games like Rimworld or Kittens. Something that you can find closure in about 20 hours of gameplay.

I feel like games have become so unwinnable, that there's a whole new market to pay people to win games.

[Cthulhu_]

20 hours for Rimworld? I've spent nearly a hundred in there and never even got close to endgame. That is a sandbox game without an end - however, one with constant entertainment though.

But I feel you about longer games starting to feel like work. I really want to like the Witcher 3 for example, but there's just so much content in there. I've started my playthrough two years ago and still haven't gotten to the end of the game. Or, I thought I did, but turns out it wasn't yet. And then there's some DLC which also got great reviews and promises of a huge amount of content.

Currently I'm playing Mass Effect: Andromeda, which bombed because of reasons but it's a pretty good game with a ton of content, can't go wrong for €7. Its missions are episodic enough that you can play for an hour at a time if you're limited in time.

[TeMPOraL]

Yeah, 20 hours for Rimworld seems impossible. I never got to the endgame, and I think on one playthrough I had something like 70+ hours before my colony collapsed. The game is hard.

Good to know about ME:A; I was a huge fan of the original ME trilogy, but didn't pick up Andromeda because reviews made it feel like not worth the time and emotional investment. Maybe I'll reconsider.

[muzani]

I didn't mean winning though. I meant closure, as in you can crash and burn and still have fun. If you went through 20 hours of failing in Fallout 4, it wouldn't nearly be as fun.

[dkersten]

Hah! I think I’ve spent about 500 hours in Rimworld and haven’t come close to the endgame. I’ve never gotten any of the spaceship parts or anything like that.

[muzani]

I've played Rimworld since the Kickstarter beta. Back in the old days, it was possible to finish the space ship over the weekend. I guess the game has also crept much larger and added more filler.

[dkersten]

I played it quite early too (I don't remember if I kickstarted , it or bought it after, but it was long before it was on Steam). Yes, it has become much larger, but its not filler, in my opinion, because the additional content adds additional depth and nuance to the game, characters and the story that unfolds. Much of it can also be ignored, if you so wish, because its based around content that you can construct (eg if you want to ignore the alcohol system, then don't grow hops and brew beer). I suppose you could call that filler, but it exists because if you do want to make use of it, its systems integrate with the games other systems and create interesting stories as it gives the characters more depth.

You're probably right though, I suppose it also made the game much harder to "complete" compared to the early days.

[muzani]

Rimworld tries its best to be a drama generator, but unfortunately doesn't do a good job at it. A lot of the additions for the drama side added little actual "depth" and more on "breadth". For example, factions, family relationships, and cleanliness are more tedious than fun. You don't really go "OMG, that's hilarious", you go "Oh come on why'd you have to kill your daughter?"

I think is the big problem with many AAA games these days is that breadth (more unnecessary features) is a lot easier than adding depth.

Compare with Dwarf Fortress, where you can make a mermaid bone farming industry, reservoirs, magma powered river thawing system, waterfall dining rooms, or a magma powered waste disposal system.

[II2II]

My feelings are somewhat more mixed. Many open world games are wonderful for both the creative output of their developers and because it allows for more creative game play from the player. Closure isn't really a big thing to me since it is all about exploring the worlds and creating my own place in it. If anything, the lack of closure is a bit of a bonus since there is always something to return to.

On the other hand, I am often left questioning the value exploration and creativity in virtual worlds when there are so many alternatives. This is especially true since many of those alternatives can be equally engaging and relaxing.

[ytjohn]

You might like Waking Mars. It would be a shorter game, probably finish in a week of evenings, and I could see doing it in an otherwise non-productive weekend. The gameplay really sucks you in. Here's the review that got me into it.

https://jayisgames.com/review/waking-mars.php