[naravara]

Kids is actually a tough case, especially when they're infants. You actually need to haul around a bunch of stuff to take a kid out and transit is rarely design around the needs of parents. Strollers are a pain to get into a bus or train, and often worsen crowding because they're so big. And it's just not practical to have to get car seats in and out of car-shares or cabs. Even in places with well considered transit options, like urban Japan, most people who can afford to have a car prefer to get a car.

[burlesona]

Yes and no. I’ve raised three kids in a highly urban area with good transit. It’s a lot easier to walk than deal with car seats or strollers - though it’s slow. It’also easier to hop on the bus than load up the car, and the kids think it’s a fun adventure (seriously).

That said we do have a car and also use it a lot. I think it has a lot to do with the time sensitivity. If you want to go some place and it’s not a quick walk or a straight shot on transit, or if you are going to get groceries or other bulky stuff, then yeah the car is easier.

I think, though, the idea is if you design a place such that you don’t HAVE to have a car, then cars would be driven vastly less. For us that’s true, combined my family of five drives about 7000 miles per year, much of that on road trips from the Bay Area to Tahoe or Yosemite etc.

[naravara]

>I think, though, the idea is if you design a place such that you don’t HAVE to have a car, then cars would be driven vastly less. For us that’s true, combined my family of five drives about 7000 miles per year, much of that on road trips from the Bay Area to Tahoe or Yosemite etc.

Yeah. A lot of people fear that a transit centered city means we're gonna take ALL the cars. Realistically I think most transit/urbanist advocates are aiming for a world with 1 practical car per family rather than 1 car per driving age member of the household.

[sandworm101]

I'd extend this from "kids" to "dependents". Anyone trying to move a disabled person, or simply an elderly relative, will opt for private transportation. For me it is a question of reliability. If the train is cancelled, the bus is late, or the power goes out, the private car allows a degree of privacy and safety unmatched by public transport. You think changing a kids diaper on the train is bad, try it with a 150lb wheelchair-bound adult, one who may not have the mental capacity to understand why the train has stopped.

[icebraining]

That's one reason to gently push the others into public transport and bicycles; leaves more room for those who really need a car.

[ak217]

Or live in an area (design and build areas) with good childcare options within walking distance. (Where "walking distance" is up to a mile away, not what Americans have gotten used to.)

Modern car seats and LATCH anchors actually make it fairly easy to bring a child car seat with you. I agree with you though, all this stuff is bulky and adds up to a lot of baggage. It makes sense to have a car for your child. But those cars create enormous problems, and car owners should be required to pay to fix them.

[dsfyu404ed]

For nearly essential services (like child care, groceries, etc.) having a population that must go to one or a few particular establishment(s) out of geographical necessity is a recipe for rent seeking and other bad behavior.

See also: food deserts

[Xylakant]

I have 5 large child care facilities in walking distance (< 15 minutes), countless smaller ones, 4 supermarket chains within 10 minutes plus all the smaller stores and I don't even live in a particular dense area of Berlin. The denser the city gets, the more options can be made available within a certain distance.

[majewsky]

There are at least 6 supermarkets within a mile of my apartment (in Dresden, not an incredibly dense city). That's plenty of competition in practice. And many other services like child care or health care are not an issue either since those are (mostly) paid for by the state.

[adrianN]

Where I grew up there were three Kindergartens and two supermarkets within walking distance. A short bus ride away were many more. How many options do you think are necessary to avoid the bad behavior that you fear?

[dsfyu404ed]

Those sound like reasonable numbers. A number of options higher than 1 within walking distance is atypical in my experience.

[Gravityloss]

I'm not sure, are you saying that cars promote diversity and prevent food deserts?

I find the opposite to be true. If there are lots of people walking, there will be lots of walkable services and businesses, so you tend to have a lot of choice.

Ownership of houses is usually diverse in dense walkable cities so it's really easy to just rent space at the ground floor to start a business. If you don't like it, move across the street.

Compare this to car cities. People drive their cars to malls. Malls are very much rent seeking. I've heard that they constantly increase rents of the shops so there would be churn - new shops to "keep it interesting" for the visitors.