[stupidbird]

There are a lot of shifts that changed The Simpsons, but the biggest one for me was the shift to being almost constantly satirical.

Classic Simpsons would occasionally get a bit satirical or referential (like when Bush Sr made a guest appearance), but modern Simpsons seems more satirical than not. Episodes like the one featuring the "MyPod" with "Steve Mobs" basically had my eyes rolling into the back of my head. That's such low-hanging fruit that they're picking it up off the ground. It's not even good enough to be considered sophomoric.

I want to watch The Simpsons and be entertained about ridiculous situations in _their_ world, and sure, throw in a wink to reality now and then. I don't really care for the family-friendly The Onion-light treatment.

[josefresco]

I would put the "blame" on this shift onto successful, adult cartoons like South Park and Family Guy which took satire and 'offensive comedy" to a new level. Suddenly The Simpsons seemed old, slow and out of touch compared to the new generation.

The downside to all this satire (I've only realized recently), is that younger audiences (and even older folks) don't always recognize it, and take the jokes too literally. I believe this has helped to 'normalize' extremist views and has helped fuel the anti-political correct movement.

[afterburner]

Forget younger audiences. I was hearing people at work parrot the "both sides" BS from South Park directly.

[josefresco]

To be fair/accurate, the South Park generation (myself included) is no longer "young".

South Park is great if everyone is in on the joke. They tend to make fun of BOTH sides of every issue, showing the insanity and hypocrisy along the way. A smart person realizes what is right and wrong. The danger of this are those who "don't get it" and think being a giant asshole is funny/cool.

The same thing applies to Howard Stern fans. Part of his audience understands satire, and realizes the absurdity of the humor. The other part, thinks racist/sexist/offensive jokes are just hilarious.

[afterburner]

I agree, although you could interpret that approach as a cynical attempt to capture a wider audience. It's similar to when a show throws both liberals and conservatives a bone using various characters or dialogue.

[josefresco]

I do think it was/is an attempt to bring us all together (humor can do that for painful subjects). Similar to Facebook's original vision, I think the creators didn't realize what in fact they DID create - a divisive platform that is driving us all apart.

[Bartweiss]

This is a really interesting point.

I think there's some truth to the claim that Family Guy cut in on the "cartoon family relationships" and "cartoon family slapstick" markets, but I'd never quite grasped why the attempt to branch out failed so badly. Now that you point it out, Family Guy even did politics and current events (or at least picked at South Park's scraps), but it never really went in for the sort of quieter, knowing satire you see in The Onion.

That was something the Simpsons had gotten huge acclaim for (e.g. "Marge Vs The Monorail", "Last Exit to Springfield"), so it was an obvious place to look for a niche. But that's also really hard to maintain. The Onion itself has always had a lot of mediocre content, but that doesn't need to animate it's content and doesn't ask you to stare at one bit for 30 minutes straight. Heck, SNL has one of the best comedy writing teams anywhere and it has some seriously weak moments that need to be offset with celebrity guests, music, and rapid sketch changes.

The other thing that strikes me is that the near-realism of the Simpsons constrains the satire. Futurama's take on the 'eyePod' was hilarious, but the reason it worked so much better than the 'myPod' was that the sci-fi setting let them take the topic ludicrously far. "You Only Move Twice" (the supervillain Simpson's episode) was excellent and arguably satire, but it was also at the upper edge of how wacky the Simpson's universe ever gets. By Season Eight or so, it feels like The Simpsons had done a first-rate episode on almost every piece of small-town and nuclear-family life worth parodying, and couldn't break out of their constrained focus or their realistic setting far enough to find new fertile ground. Meanwhile, Futurama got to play around with Nixon and Mom's Friendly Robots and alien invaders and anything else that came to mind - plus with no one else in the sci-fi cartoon space they could save the satire for when they had something excellent to do.

[stupidbird]

Exactly! The 'eyePod' comparison is really good. I haven't thought of that before but it's spot on.

Ultimately, yeah, they probably ran out of possible new material (they even joked about doing the same themes across multiple episodes within episodes).

I think it would have been better off cancelled once Season 10 rolled around.

They could be doing the show they do now with different characters entirely, and they'd probably have a more accurate sense of quality that's not clouded with nostalgia.

It's no surprise that FOX doesn't understand going out on a high note though. I admittedly probably hung around until season 20 just because of the previous 10 seasons of goodwill.

[bradleyankrom]

> Classic Simpsons would occasionally get a bit satirical or referential (like when Bush Sr made a guest appearance), but modern Simpsons seems more satirical than not. Episodes like the one featuring the "MyPod" with "Steve Mobs" basically had my eyes rolling into the back of my head. That's such low-hanging fruit that they're picking it up off the ground. It's not even good enough to be considered sophomoric.

And the Futurama take on this was just as bad (and I love Futurama). IMO, South Park is the best at doing this kind of satire... I can't point to exactly why, though. Being on cable allows them to push edgier jokes, but I'm sure it's more than that.

[pitaj]

> And the Futurama take on this was just as bad

At least with Futurama, Mom was an established character and they were able to comment on other internet culture like Twitter.

[lostgame]

I think it's because South Park has always been a vehicle to comment, usually specifically, on current events and popular culture. The world of South Park is really a sandbox for Trey and Matt to caricature whatever they're choosing to ream on that particular week.

The Simpsons, Futurama, when they address these kinds of issues, they feel like they're 'reaching' for it. Or, worse, just 'not trying'.

Someone else here mentioned The Simpsons, and the Family Guy, were much better at the time that they focused on the struggles of the families themselves.

I believe that this is because unlike South Park, where, even from the name, the town itself seems to be the focus. Which allows it to be moreso whatever they want it to be.

'The Simpsons' and the 'Family Guy', are meant to satirize, or at least revolve around, the daily struggles of the 'American Middle Class Family'.

When they don't, and they reach for 'current' events, which often usually feel dated by the episode release due to the extended 6-9 month production period, they seem stale and unfunny. South Park's 6-day production period, awesomely described in the fantastic documentary 'Six Days to Air', allows South Park to comment literally on things that happened the day before. It's incredibly hard to make that feel 'stale.' Really, worst-case scenario, South Park just doesn't seem 'funny' enough sometimes (this season hasn't been great), but definitely never 'irrelevant'.

The early seasons and episodes of the Simpsons are timeless. Many of them could've happened any time over the last three or four decades.

• 'Homer's Enemy' (S08E23) - A new employee at work gets jealous of Homer's 'easy' life.

• 'Mr. Plow' (S04E09) - Hijinks occur when Homer and Barney start competing snow removal businesses.

• 'Homer the Heretic' (S04E03) - Homer decides he doesn't need to attend church any more, and Marge doesn't like the example that demonstrates for the kids.

• 'You Only Move Twice' (S08E02) - Homer is offered a new work opportunity in a 'perfect' town. This episode does involve satire, but James Bond is such an old trope, and the films are still coming out, therefore it doesn't seem 'stale'.

None of these classic and fan favourite episodes rely on tropes of the era. They're still as funny today as when they were released. (Especially 'You Only Move Twice'. What a gem. Oh, Scorpio.)

Futurama, as well, does best when it focuses on it's sci-fi premise. It's supposed to be the future. We don't need comments about Apple products in there, we want the mind-bending 'Rick and Morty'-level plots of 'Roswell that Ends Well', or the genuine moments of emotion like Fry's dog at the end of 'Jurassic Bark'.

Again, it seems like early seasons of these cartoon sitcoms have a habit of sticking to their initial premise, and maybe perhaps the creator's visions. There's tons of reasons for this, but in 'The Simpsons' case, the death of Phil Hartman in 1998 drastically affected the show as a whole. I think a lot of the spirit was lost along with him. RIP, Troy McClure.

[bradleyankrom]

missed your reply a couple of weeks ago but really appreciate this.