[shady-lady]

Exactly. So the solution YouTube has isn't appropriate. They should invest in a better solution even if that involves having more humans in the loop for review/approval.

That's the true cost of their business. They'd just like to portray it as the law being an ass rather than their solution being inadequate for the laws.

It's a clear case of "Our machines aren't humans and we don't want to have to comply with laws that could substantially damage our payroll spend"

[tyfon]

Having more humans in the loop would probably benefit the content creators as they could actually reason with them and claim fair use for stuff. Provided that they actually hire competent staff for this.

I don't monetise my videos by default but I've have a few videos where I have had 1-2 minutes of copyrighted music. When that happens they will force monetise the whole video for me and send the money made by it to the music copyright holder (BGM in my case). That seems a bit silly to me.

[feri339]

How would you ever manually review 400 hours of video per minute (likely much more by now). It's just impossible. And who is to say that the human reviewers would make no mistakes. It's not always a clear cut decision I'm guessing.

So either you have an automated and overzealous ContentID system or you limit upload capabilities for smaller creators (which would be the death of the internet).

Obviously the best solution would be to burden the copyright owners with prooving that they own certain content. So just DMCA pretty much. The copyright system is just so broken really. It only favors big content owners and middle men.

This whole shitty EU law comes down to this: Old media/distributers were asleep at the wheel for 20 years. Now they realize they're being replaced. So they fight back the only big slow incumbents know how. Legislation and law suits.

[SpelingBeeChamp]

> The copyright system is just so broken really. It only favors big content owners and middle men.

Lol no.

It favors people who create original works of authorship that are fixed in a tangible medium of expression. Nothing more, nothing less.

It does not favor people who feel entitled to steal others' intellectual property, and/or who try to circumvent protections.

I really enjoy making docudramas and people enjoy what I create enough that they pay for it. That only works because of copyright.

I regularly pay the copyright office a $50 fee to register the works I create that I believe are most likely to be infringed. I also send around a dozen DMCA takedown notices once or twice a week. If not for the DMCA I would be sending cease and desist letters and filing lawsuits. This is way better.

(It should be noted that the DMCA does not take away my right to sue infringers (and win). It simply provides a simple way for me to quickly stop unauthorized distribution of my work, which happens to be what I care about most, as without the ability to control the distribution of my creative work I could not even dream of making a living from it. Without the existence of powerful tools to stop people from simply copying my work I wouldn't be making it. Which would suck.)

> Now they realize they're being replaced. So they fight back the only big slow incumbents know how. Legislation and law suits.

What do you recommend? Fistfights?

[feri339]

> I regularly pay the copyright office a $50 fee to register the works I create that I believe are most likely to be infringed. I also send around a dozen DMCA takedown notices once or twice a week. If not for the DMCA I would be sending cease and desist letters and filing lawsuits. This is way better.

Yeah that's true. I'm saying DMCA is better than ContentID and its ilk.

Let's take a piracy example. I completely agree that DMCA-Takedowns directed at Google should be checked and (if the claim is valid) processed. It gets very problematic when you proactively filter uploads. Uploads should generally be allowed by default.

> What do you recommend? Fistfights?

No. Adapt. I realize this is easier said than done. But any company today has to constantly innovate. Never assume any given business model is save for anything more than short to mid-term. This is easier for tech companies because they breathe this kind of culture. But in the not-so-distant future every company will become more like that, or not exist anymore.

[shady-lady]

> This is easier for tech companies because they breathe this kind of culture.

Eh, no. Tech companies have, by and large, just ignored existing legislation thus enabling them to host mountains of content at negligible cost.

They opened the floodgates - they should deal with the water (both that which is original & that which is stolen). They are 100% the cause of this issue and should be 100% of the solution.

If they're not able to do that, then they should get out of the business altogether.

Ignoring laws to lower your costs is not innovative in the slightest. Using the excuse that the internet is a new medium is malarky. Existing rules apply.

[gotocake]

Maybe if you can’t manage your platform, the problem is that your platform shouldn’t be so big? In the same way that the answer to packing a club that can safely hold 100 people with 1000 people isn’t to shrug and say “well, of course we can’t safely manage this many, what did you expect?”

[Navarr]

You want an internet with upload queues?

[gotocake]

I want an Internet with alternatives to Google who can compete, because Google isn’t allowed to automate QC. If a platform can’t control itself, it shouldn’t be allowed to automate the control incompetently and call it good, then hide behind algorithms.

[SpelingBeeChamp]

Are you seriously proposing regulation of one specific private company just because you don't like the way they run their business? Man, I'm glad you're not in charge.

Google is not a government service, and YouTube (forget about YouTube-As-You-Want-It) is not a constitutional right.

Have you forgotten that you are talking about an advertising company? That's what Google is.

Don't like the business decisions of a private company? Don't patronize it.

And hey, if you think that you can do better (and that people would give a shit) you can start your competing business. There are many alternatives to every one of Google's business lines, and there are very low barriers to entry.

Fundamentally, though: why are you using a company's product that you dislike so much?

[gotocake]

Are you seriously proposing regulation of one specific private company just because you don't like the way they run their business?

No, this could apply equally to all companies, FaceBook and Twitter for example, or Amazon and their counterfeits. If your platform is too big for you to manage in a way that complies with basic consumer protections, you either need to step up your controls, or shrink your platform.

[feri339]

And what exactly would a competing service do differently? The only thing protecting the internet as we know it is the fact that platforms are not responsible for what users post. That is changing and it's a terrible trend.

[shady-lady]

> And what exactly would a competing service do differently?

Do what services should do? Review the content before it's publicly available to ensure it's not breaking laws.

> That is changing and it's a terrible trend

I feel the opposite. For far too long, internet companies have taken liberties of everything being 'opt out' instead of 'opt in'. This is another example of that.

[dtech]

> How would you ever manually review 400 hours of video per minute (likely much more by now). It's just impossible.

An automated filter is fine as long as mistakes can get arbitrated by a human, so the actual amount of human review required is much lower.

[feri339]

Which is what is happening today. It's just not efficient enough yet. The mistake made by the algo is reported by the uploader. It then takes (too much) time to be handled by a human.

[bdhess]

> or you limit upload capabilities for smaller creators (which would be the death of the internet)

Would it? I feel like it would actually spark innovation in the host-your-own space. Which is closer to the original vision of the internet than submitting your content to a third party host that pre-screens it for approval.