[yonoataraxia]

This is a great analysis of Nietzsche. It's rare to find people who really understand what he's trying to say. Many people interpret him in inaccurate ways.

Essentially, Nietzsche is a person who touches very sensitive parts of being human after he analyzed society. He is a person who asked uncomfortable questions about existence in his quest to describe nihilism. Nihilism is the consequence of the loss of morality and the total annihilation of ones values and belief system - and the loss of morality stems from the "death of god" which means that we got to the point (in science) where there were exceedingly small areas of unknowns. Many questions - also about right and wrong - were suddenly more informed due to increasing knowledge.

What makes Nietzsche great is his ability to foresee what this leads to. It's like he knew what will happen in the future. And he tried to give us a solution using "will to power". I'm not necessarily a fan of his solution, but I appreciate it. He's a man who had a positive attitude towards people and society. He wanted to help society. This deep empathy based on insane levels of self-awareness and profundity is what I like about him. Unfortunately, his ideas were not understood properly and used by fascists (the "master race" of the Nazis is built on the definition of ubermensch a.k.a. superman). Which is the reason I really appreciate your comment.

I think that "will to power" is one of many possible solutions. But everyone has to find a solution for the big deep hole of emptiness in their existence. Failing to find a solution leads to nihilism which is a very painful and unpleasant place to be (although it has the advantage that you don't have to take responsibilities - for some people this can feel better than dealing with their emptiness). If we as a society fail to help to give people different solutions for this emptiness, it will lead to a society full of unhappy people who are in quiet despair. We can see that this is already happening.

So Nietzsche talked about a question that hit us hard 100 years after his death. Sometimes we acknowledge when sci-fi authors were able to predict the future. I would like to acknowledge that Nietzsche was able to anticipate our reality based on his knowledge of human nature. In the same realm I would like to thank Sigmund Freud - both shared similar thoughts about the human nature which shows that Nietzsche was also a type of psychologist (before it was a distinct research field). Sigmund Freud once articulated his admiration for Nietzsches work and said that Nietzsches thoughts were amazing in that they captured many thoughts that Freud thought to be true due to his works in psychoanalysis.

[bsenftner]

When the emotional reasoning of Nietzsche is removed, what is left is very close to Zen Buddhism. In fact, there is a large informal philosophy group that self identifies with "Zen Nihilism". I'm one.

[mindgam3]

Nihilism is not at all aligned with Buddhism. This is a common misperception due to a misunderstanding of so-called emptiness practice. The point of emptiness teachings (that nothing has inherent meaning in and of itself) isn’t that everything is meaningless and we should all stop caring. I won’t argue about the pros and cons of nihilism - if it’s working for you, great, but please don’t spread misconceptions about Buddhism in order to justify or support these views.

[armitron]

Nihilism is exactly what Buddhism represents, in its passive form (rather than the active form of nihilism that Nietzsche offers as a solution) which is why the term "passive nihilism" is used by Nietzsche and Schopenhauer to describe it.

In other words, the key word for Buddhism is detachment (passive).

The key word for active forms of nihilism is destruction. The tearing down of established symbols in order to make way for each person to create his own.

[mindgam3]

You seem to be making a common mistake about Buddhist detachment. It may be helpful to refer to a simplified version of Buddhism's 4 Noble Truths:

1. Suffering exists.

2. Suffering arises from attachment to desires.

3. Suffering ceases when attachment to desire ceases.

4. Freedom from suffering is possible by practicing the Eightfold Path.

A few points:

- Buddhist detachment isn't detachment from everything — it's detachment from desires, which becomes possible when you recognize that suffering underlies all desirable things.

- The point of detachment, and of buddhism at its core, is to reduce suffering. As opposed to passive nihilism, which is "epitomized by resignation" (at least according to google, I had to look it up https://antimodernist.wordpress.com/2012/09/06/active-vs-pas...)

- The next step after detachment is a set of practices to reduce suffering. Some of the most powerful are the compassion (metta) meditations, i.e. "May I be free from suffering, may those near to me be free from suffering, may all beings be free from suffering". Working to reduce the suffering of all beings is the opposite of resignation.

As my own buddhist teacher (Dan Brown, www.pointingoutway.org) explained it to me, many beginning buddhists get stuck on the detachment part, which leads to nihilism, which leads to resignation, which leads to more suffering. In contrast, "properly executed" buddhist detachment leads to practices that reduce suffering (the Eightfold Path).

Hope that helps.

[misja111]

I have no idea why this was downvoted.

[yonoataraxia]

I think that the emotional aspect is really important. If you just remove it, you might miss something that is fundamental to human nature. And just removing it is almost certainly a type of self-delusion because the emotional aspect is very hard to remove from human existence.

But yes, if you achieve a level of self-awareness where you're able to live in a near-nihilistic state and be content with it, it can be quite pleasant, although it's very hard to achieve.

Pure nihilism would lead to beings who don't want anything and therefore don't do anything - but even if you want to pee or "achieve nihilism" you stop being a complete nihilist because you start to want something. So it's a catch-22 here. As long as those Zen Nihilists know that they can't achieve pure nihilism and treat it as a goal which can't be reached (like wisdom), I think it can be a good solution (otherwise it could lead to a silly competition where all followers just try to tell everybody how "nihilistic" they are). Not for most of us, but I'm glad you found something.

[armitron]

The poster to whom you replied has missed the essence of Nietzsche's writings. There is no such thing as "pure nihilism". Rather, Nietzsche talks of passive and active forms of nihilism with passive leading towards detachment and the abandonment of self (eastern mysticism, Schopenhauer favorite) and active being what Nietzsche espouses and offers up as a solution.

Active nihilism is all about "praxis" rather than detachment. The quote from Blade Runner comes to mind:

"The light that burns twice as bright burns half as long - and you have burned so very, very brightly, Roy."

Nietzsche would like every human being to burn like Roy Batty. Humanity performing a wild leap into the unknown trying to manifest its evolutionary potential, free from the straightjacket of religion and inherited morality.

[bsenftner]

Don't forget the essential absurdist humor perspective, which is another common misunderstanding by young "existentialists": self-awareness in a nihilistic frame of reference has a strong undercurrent of jovial humor, as in "well, ain't this just grande".

[yonoataraxia]

I like this perspective very much. George Carlin in his later years has a lot of it in his shows.

And of course the great humor of SMBC: https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/2011-10-10

Share some comedians, would love to see some new stuff.

[bsenftner]

Not necessarily a comedian, here's an existential absurdist comic along these lines that I read nearly 40 years ago you might enjoy: http://forbiddenplanet.blog/2014/nemo-nemo-nemo/ I remember visiting an art gallery of the original art for "Spice Of Death" around the same time period.

[jeremyt]

I’m flogging Ken Wilber these days. Perhaps take a look at “The Religion of Tomorrow”

[bsenftner]

Looks quite worthwhile, thanks! Found this discussing him: https://markmanson.net/ken-wilber ("The rise and fall of...")