[tamatsyk]

Good summary, I share most of the points provided in the post.

Also, I think a few more things worth to mention.

Pros:

- XPS has a decent hardware (I got 16GB, i8Gen, 500GB SSD and forgot about having a few docker containers running on the background which was an issue with my MacBook Pro 15 (8GB, 2.5Gh)

- It is really 1k$ cheaper than the same config MacBook model. Apple's Retina and Touchbar are really cool, however, they still do not have 16GB 13' mac which is a deal breaker.

- Touchscreen. Take your touch bar and put it into your missing 3.5 jack plug, Tim's Team, why would I need a touch bar when I have a touchscreen; (no offense to Apple, I still own a few apples because they are nice)

- the webcam is well described, but it is not that bad, it saves a few inches in size which makes its screen look like it takes all space and there are no borders at all;

- while ubuntu became usable with Gnome desktop I almost did not notice all missing Apple's out of the box features;

- it is very light (~1kg), my backpack can be heavier;

Cons:

- WiFi is super shitty in XPS series. If you have not had any issues yet - then you have not bought one yet. It is better to replace with 30$ adapter to not have issues with differently configured routers;

- It has Windows on it and some features are not supported on Linux. For instance, I see no sense in having fingerprint scanner if it does not work under Linux;

- Be aware that screen scaling might not work on some linux machines. For ubuntu 16.04 I got windows so small so I cannot read the text. Luckily 18.04 fixed it, but still;

Overall, it is the best laptop for Linux I've used so far (Lenovo and Asus are good ones as well), having good hardware and being more or less cheap. I hope Apple will simplify ML and add a bit more RAM to Autumn's laptops, otherwise, there are no reasons to go back.

[ythn]

> WiFi is super shitty in XPS series.

Holy cow, yes. My wife's XPS 13 had the crappiest Killer WiFi card, and Dell would not acknolwedge that it was the source of all of our issues no matter what I tried, no matter what evidence I presented. The WiFi card was causing all sorts of issues from slow browsing, to the entire computer freezing on restart/shutdown, to no WiFi after wake up from sleep... the list goes on.

I finally rage quit after a session with Dell support had me run hours of meaningless diagnostics tools and then said everything was ok and to check my router. I told them right from the get go that I suspected the Killer WiFi card was faulty, but the technicians always ignored that piece of info.

I bought an Intel 8265 to replace the Killer WiFi card, and when I went to replace it, the antenna ball broke off of the Killer card and was stuck inside the little socket! There was a tiny flake of solder I was able to grab with my finest pliers and pull it out, allowing me to install the Intel card. After installing the Intel card EVERY SINGLE PROBLEM described earlier went away.

https://www.amazon.com/Intel-8265-Generic-2230-8265NGWMG/dp/...

$30 was all it would have taken to make the XPS 13 from a piece of garbage to an awesome laptop. I'm already paying $1000+, why not $1030+? But now, I will never buy another XPS again because it required 10+ hours of my time to troubleshoot and fix all by myself.

[filleduchaos]

> and forgot about having a few docker containers running on the background which was an issue with my MacBook Pro 15 (8GB, 2.5Gh)

It's almost as if Docker has to start and run in a VM on non-Linux systems.

> however, they still do not have 16GB 13' mac which is a deal breaker.

What are you talking about? You've been able to upgrade the memory in a 13 inch MBP to 16GB on purchase since like 2015 at least

> Touchscreen

I've had two traditional laptops with touchscreens. Both times they got in my way and I stop using the touchscreen after like three months max.

On a 2-in-1 like the Surface Book where touch is a first-class input it's a completely different story, but on traditional laptops a touchscreen is far from an ideal user input device. It's like the N64 controller - you're left wondering if the manufacturer thinks you have a third arm coming out of your chest or something. To use it you have to take your hand completely off one of your two much better input devices (keyboard and trackpad/mouse) and hold your arm in an awkward, quickly painful position if your laptop is in a normal position (on a fairly flat surface with the screen straight or maybe tilted back a little, a couple of feet away from you max). The touch bar isn't the greatest design decision but moving a finger up to tap e.g. the bookmark app control in Chrome is a far more natural movement than lifting my hand to the screen to attempt to poke at the bookmark star which is rendered at like half the size of my fingertip.

[mdaniel]

> It's almost as if Docker has to start and run in a VM on non-Linux systems.

Just as an FYI, that's no longer true for both macOS (xhyve) and Windows (unknown underlying tech, but compiling and running dockerd behaved reasonably with the exception that one could only run Windows docker images). In fact, IIRC, even Docker for Mac uses xhyve, so only docker-machine folks use the VM-based solution

[GordonS]

Realistically, it is still true on Windows - unless your containers don't need chmod, chown or any of the other rather fundamental syscalls that are still not supported under LCOW

[ender341341]

They do 16gb 13" macbook pros (I'm typing this on an early 2015 that came with 16gb).

They don't have 32GB laptops which would be useful for some of my work though.

[tamatsyk]

Oh, you are right, not sure why I was almost sure it does not exist. Good catch!

[IOT_Apprentice]

You can even get the MacBook itself with 16GB now. Looks like 32GB is next up for MacBook Pro.

[ender341341]

The lack of a 32GB option pops up in almost every HN macbook story so maybe from that.

[2xlbuds]

I also used an XPS 15 for personal and work before switching to a Macbook, and it was also much thicker than a retina MBP. I didn't have a touchscreen model, but the touchpad was probably the best touchpad I have used on a windows machine (it even had good gesture support, like 4 finger swipe to switch programs). It did have some weird quirks like the optical drive would make a loud mechanical noise whenever you turned it on, and the screen would often get dust stuck behind it which was basically impossible to clean.

By the way, all Macbook pro models still have the 3.5mm audio jack.

[tamatsyk]

> By the way, all Macbook pro models still have the 3.5mm audio jack.

Ha-ha, you are right, it was a reference to a scandal they had when removed audio jack from phones. Just a joke :)

[spatular]

I have XPS13 with Killer wifi (Atheros QCA6174). At first there were stability problems but they were completely solved with FW update from Atheros's github repo and a kernel update (to >= 4.9 I think).

Later it turned out that an Intel 8260 card I've bought to use in PC-based AP cannot be coerced to work in 5GHz band no matter what I did, so I've swapped them, now Atheros is in AP and Intel is in XPS, with everything working flawlessly. So it turned out that the Intel card is less functional...

[bogomipz]

>"WiFi is super shitty in XPS series. If you have not had any issues yet - than you have not bought one yet. It is better to replace with 30$ adapter to not have issues with differently configured routers;"

This is really surprising. Can you say what specific replacement worked for you on that laptop?

[AdmiralAsshat]

The 9343 model shipped with a Broadcom wifi card, which was a PITA to get working on Linux. I swapped mine out for an Intel 7265, which has kernel support, so, any distro I throw on there works instantly without having to download a bunch of drivers.

More recent models have switched to the "Killer" brand wifi card, and I'm not sure whether those have in-kernel support or if it's another akmod thing.

[tamatsyk]

Yeah, it was nice for a first few weeks and when I went travelling I got into issues. Some WiFi's did not work and a guy with a MBP next to me was just smiling :D

Just google for XPS WiFi issue and you will get plenty of results. This model should be a good fit: Intel 8265 Generic, 2230, 2x2 AC+BT (8265NGWMG), look for Intel wifi cards they are much much better than default ones.

[e12e]

Wifi hw is also an issue for surface pro 4 (under windows and Linux both). Apparently ms finally fixed in the 5th generation.

Anyone know if there's any really great wifi cards internal or USB, that allows full AP, "war driving" etc - and also 5ghz and such? Preferably with great drivers for Linux and freebsd?

(I doubt internal is an option for my surface pro 4, but for refurbished ThinkPads/dells it might do the trick..)

[spatular]

XPS's Atheros QCA6174 works fine with recent FW. I use it in AP mode in 5GHz band in ac mode, though I had to adapt a kernel patch from OpenWRT that ignores frequency regdomains. I've also tried to use Intel 8260 for this, but with no luck.

[jonmb]

I also have the XPS and have experienced my WiFi dropping. Usually a few times a week. I've heard you can contact Dell support and they will send you a wifi adapter but I haven't tried it yet myself. Curious to hear of specific replacement options too.

[Macha]

I had massive issues with the Killer Wifi until I installed an (April 2018 iirc?) driver update from the Dell website. Dell's update tool didn't seem to install it.

[bogomipz]

That stinks. You would think a decent wifi chipset would be a solved problem in 2018. Especially from a company that has been shipping laptops for as long as Dell has.

[ender341341]

Back when I was running linux on a laptop I found intel adapters to have really awesome driver support and didn't have any issues.

[CoolGuySteve]

I need RAM, battery life, and a matte display above everything else, so it really bothers me that Dell refuses to sell a 16GB XPS13 with the 1080p display.

So much so, that I think I'm going to go with Asus for my next ultrabook.

[shasts]

If you are in Europe you can get one with 16GB and HD display.

http://www.dell.com/en-uk/shop/laptops-notebooks-and-2-in-1-...

£1,498.99 GBP one in above list.

[CoolGuySteve]

Wow, $2000! That's quite expensive for what it is. I didn't realize Dell costs so much over there.

[rz2k]

Removing the 3.5mm jack from phones was an exasperating way to push air pods, but they didn’t do the same thing to their laptops. You can plug headphones into the latest MacBook Pros without any sort of adapter.

[gxs]

The trackpad is what kills me. On the Mac, the non-mechanical touchpad is so efficient, at least as a pointing device can be.

It's spacious, I don't get erroneous output, and most importantly, you get a uniform click no matter where on the trackpad your finger is.

In the hinged trackpads, it's a pain to click at the top - often you have to slide your finger down.

This is less of an issue if you're more of a keyboard only type - but for me it's one of the first things I notice when I use a windows laptop.

Other pros/cons I more or less agree on, but in my book this is a big one that is commonly left out.

[tamatsyk]

Agree, moved to tap-click in a first day. As time goes you get use to it but it is still far from Mac touchpad (even more I have not seen anything better in any laptops)

[eropple]

Can't speak to the XPS 13, but on the HP Spectre x360 13", I can click, without undue pressure, anywhere except when my finger is literally touching the top edge of the trackpad. I have the same experience on my 2014 Retina MBP, too. I feel like you might be overstating the benefits (which exist, but IMO are not that big) of the non-mechanical touchpad just a little.

[gxs]

Maybe you're right, but for me it was a little jarring at first.

Little things like that add up - and it's nice when they are just completely out of the way. FWIW I don't have the issue you reported, I can click anywhere on the trackpad, even the very edge. Mostly useful when you're dragging and dropping or selecting text etc.

[finolex1]

You could switch to tapping the touchpad to select (instead of clicking it), which in imo is a lor more convenient.

[fixermark]

This was a great summary. I should have thought to write it (I 'm in the same camp, including the "Used to own a Mac" part).

Nod of agreement to the wifi issue, and the fact that it's extremely fixable with a plug-in adapter.

[usaphp]

> Take your touch bar and put it into your missing 3.5 jack plug

Are you sure you are talking about MacBooks? They all have a 3.5 jack