[relics443]

Entirely incorrect.

As an orthodox Jew, I can tell you that failure to circumcize your son at 8 days old (outside of extenuating circumstances, e.g. medical issues) is one of the worst sins you could commit.

Furthermore, you would be ostracized from the community, and your child will suffer socially, and emotionally.

Once the child turns 13 he is responsible to ensure that he it's circumcised, and considering that he most likely will not have abandoned his religion by 13 he will go through with it. So now there's physical pain as well.

[gotchange]

That's a theological critique, mine was sociological one from an outside observer. Still, the theological arguments don't work under a secular government which takes pride in separating the state from religion.

[relics443]

They do. It's called religious persecution.

And if a government would ban circumcision, I'd be willing to bet that all Orthodox Jews would leave. And if the government prevented that (which has certainly happened before), then it is well documented that many Jews are ready to give up their lives in order to circumcise their sons.

Update: only my first comment was theological; the rest were socio-physical

[spraak]

Babies feel pain, which you seem to be saying they don't with:

> by 13 he will go through with it. So now there's physical pain as well.

[relics443]

I'm not saying they don't. But the experience is forgotten quickly.

[spraak]

It's really not. There is evidence [1] that the trauma of circumcision lasts a lifetime

1. One example is Ch 4 and 5 of http://www.circumcision.org/cht.htm