[tejtm]

I do agree, but that is just the good news. In other news although we can harbor optimistic thoughts for scientists, medical professionals, lawmakers and maybe even politicians all around the globe to do the "right" thing to preserve human life in a currently recognizable form, but there is not a force on heaven or earth that is going to stop parents from trying to give their children every advantage.

[gasbag]

> In other news although we can harbor optimistic thoughts for scientists, medical professionals, lawmakers and maybe even politicians all around the globe to do the "right" thing to preserve human life in a currently recognizable form

Why is this the right thing to do? What are you signifying by putting "right" in quotes?

I am reminded of the Hyperion Cantos from Dan Simmons, where most of the human race has declared that nanotech modification of the human organism/germline is a cardinal sin. Meanwhile there is another segment of humans who decided that maybe it wasn't, and they're off colonizing deep space by remaking themselves into a wild range of body types.

In fact if we don't stop dirtying up the planet, we may feel a lot more pressure to adapt our bodies to an environment whose rate of change we can't keep up with. In any event I am sure there will be a segment of humanity that does want to preserve human life in a currently recognizable form, and they should be able to choose that for themselves. That should not stop those of us who want to vary it wildly from doing our thing too!

There are a number of ethical concerns when it comes to these kinds of changes, of course. There is the world of The Windup Girl, where competing agricorps target each other's crops with tailored viruses to wipe them (or their consumers) out. So we will need to figure out how to rebalance our societies in the light of this vast new power. Yet it looks like it may also be the start of a whole new stage in treating human diseases. Imagine a world where mass-produced medicines are mostly replaced by taking some host cells, gene sequencing the target diseases, then programming and re-injecting the cells to eliminate them. I'm not well-versed enough in this stuff to know how far-fetched that is, of course. It sounds like something out of Star Trek. But it's hard not to be optimistic about what it can enable.

[return0]

> to do the "right" thing

"right" according to whom? nature itself doesn't believe that

[mtempm]

Despite academic/political/military/banking/corporate alignment against fundamental morals, "right" appears to be in agreement with nature/natural selection. The States had a more "right" society founded om constitutional and civil rights that was a big part of its climb from an English colony to the world power in less than 150 years after the constitution was written.

The reason people probably have strong convictions about right or wrong is most likely because of nature, not despite it. Groups that had this genetic trait built tribes, societies that had greater success in the long term.

In the short term, individuals, or even groups of individuals, can be successful by acting amorally, but this comes as a cost to their group's long term success--the cancer analogy.

Right now there is limited competition between groups in the world. Most of what we should be competing against is the coming extinction event when something else out there gets a whiff of all the artificial elctromagnetic radiation. Probably the reason we hear so little in the cosmos is because it is not a very competitive strategy.

[golergka]

> academic/political/military/banking/corporate alignment against fundamental morals

"fundamental morals"? What are those and where the hell do you get them from?

> The reason people probably have strong convictions about right or wrong is most likely because of nature, not despite it. Groups that had this genetic trait built tribes, societies that had greater success in the long term.

Actually, couldn't agree more. But people do have _different_ convictions about right or wrong.

[mtempm]

Re fundamental morals:

I would wager >95% of people agree on these. I've never met someone who didn't have an understanding of fundamental morals, except for a few people whom I consider to be a psychopaths.

I really would bet that most of us dont need an education to know that killing children for pleasure is wrong and disgusting. However, we might be split on whether spanking your children as punoshment is wrong. I think people understand the difference.

[golergka]

> I really would bet that most of us dont need an education to know that killing children for pleasure is wrong and disgusting.

Can I remind you that abortion is legal and funded by the state in most of the first world?

It's not that I have a personal opinion on the matter (I find it too complex to develop a definite opinion), but it does come pretty close to what you're describing.

[mtempm]

It's not. An egg moments After fertilization experiencing suffering requires quite a bit of inagination, while we all can agree a child can suffer. Where we draw the line between that is obviously somewhat up for debate (and no one in their right mind is saying we should kill born babies for pleasure).

[golergka]

> we can harbor optimistic thoughts for scientists, medical professionals, lawmakers and maybe even politicians all around the globe to do the "right" thing to preserve human life in a currently recognizable form

Why do you think that preserving human life in currently recignoziable form is something all of us are optimistic for?

For me personally, this option seems like a nightmare - and I truly hope for a transhumanist future made of humans who have very advantage. Being smart, fit and (relatively) healthy is awesome, which I'm lucky to know from experience. I wish other people would be able to experience it, and then some.

[rorykoehler]

>although we can harbor optimistic thoughts for scientists, medical professionals, lawmakers and maybe even politicians all around the globe to do the "right" thing to preserve human life in a currently recognizable form

That race is already over. Technology over the last century has changed our realities so much that we can never hope to go back.