[shakna]

If it wasn't so reliant on Apache or PHP I'd be more willing to try it out.

Unfortunately, I've experienced nearly every nightmare with the two, thanks to work, bad code, and absent documentation.

I don't want them on my machine.

Any plans for a self-contained bundle?

[tcarey83]

OP here. Only the backend is written in PHP (it is very simple PHP) and that may change (probably Python, maybe Node.js). It's only a small part of the code, most of the code is javascript that runs in the browser. Initially, I am working on Apache and PHP because a lot of what I work on is Wordpress, but Nginx certainly supports PHP as well. Note that it doesn't require your code to be written in PHP, only that your server has the correct modules installed. If you use phpmyadmin you have already pretty much installed everything needed.

[shakna]

I wasn't meaning to criticise the use of PHP at all.

But creating some sort of bundle with a portable PHP and server, just a zipped folder or something, would hugely reduce the barrier to entry, and reassure people like me who shy away from part of the tech stack.

[nsabine]

Use a container to package the dependencies and runtime, so you don't need to install them on your OS.

[stephenr]

It sounds like it's written in PHP, so dependency isn't likely to go away, but it specifically says it should work fine with a server other than apache.

As for your specific issues, I find it hard to follow your complaint when it comes to docs. Both php and apache httpd projects have extensive, easy to follow documentation.

[shakna]

I realise PHP can't go away, hence "self-contained bundle".

The docs I referenced are not the official documentation, but rather mind-bendingly bad systems I've had to deal with that were undocumented.

PHP isn't necessarily bad. But bad experiences mean I hate it.

Hide the PHP in a nice self-contained system, and I won't care, plus it'll simplify install/setup.

[stephenr]

> PHP isn't necessarily bad. But bad experiences mean I hate it.

It sounds like those experiences were the fault of the developers not some intrinsic issue with the language itself. (i.e. its not like say "i hate flash because its a security shit-fueled nightmare").

Either way, the system currently has an "install script" and aims to develop deb/rpm/etc packages to achieve the same result, which seems like it's what you want.

[shakna]

Snaps would be more along the lines of what I'm suggesting.

Using the system package manager still pulls down dependencies I don't want system-wide.

[stephenr]

So, you want unpatched, unmaintained packages on your system?

The only dependencies this should have on eg Debian are PHP, SQLite and the Web Server virtual package.

[jameskegel]

How do you feel about PHP7?

[shakna]

It goes a long way to making PHP better. Better defaults, better stdlib.