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by ThomPete 3449 days ago
It's never been. Perception have always been reality and politicians have always used that to get things their way. Thats why they study rhetorics not science.

There is no objective transcendence between facts and politics decisions.

You can believe that climate change is created by humans and still decide not to do anything about it because you also believe that technology will solve most of those problem, or that there are bigger problems (astroid hitting earth for instance) etc.
1 comments
diyorgasms 3449 days ago
This is gaslighting. Facts used to matter. It used to be that politicians would substantially lose face for inconsistencies in policy (think John Kerry most recently). Now politicians claim to have never done things they are on film doing, and people believe them.

We are absolutely in a new mode of politics, one that transcends mere differences of opinion. To pretend otherwise does everyone a disservice.

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coldtea 3449 days ago
>Now politicians claim to have never done things they are on film doing, and people believe them.

"I never had sexual relations with that woman".

"Read my lips: there will be no more taxes".

"It depends on what the definition of is is".

"I will close down Guantanamo Bay".

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croon 3449 days ago
> >Now politicians claim to have never done things they are on film doing, and people believe them.

> "I never had sexual relations with that woman".

Wait, there's a sex tape of Bill Clinton?

In all seriousness, quotes are all good, but you would benefit from saying what it is you hope to achieve by them.

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ThomPete 3449 days ago
I think the point is that facts (whether on TV or not) didn't use to matter more than they do today.
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croon 3449 days ago
So you are claiming that no one cared about the Clinton scandal in the 90s?

Because no one sure didn't seem to care about the numerous Trump ones.

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mcguire 3449 days ago
Democrats surely didn't. And the prosecution side was pretty sketchy in its own right.
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ThomPete 3449 days ago
No I am claiming the opposite. That people care as much today as they did back in the 90s.
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aninhumer 3449 days ago
>"I never had sexual relations with that woman".

And he was impeached for that, which is exactly the point.

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coldtea 3449 days ago
Impeached just means they accused/questioned him about it. He remained President just fine, and was acquitted of the charges.
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Chris2048 3448 days ago
Didn't he lose a law license or something as well?
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coldtea 3448 days ago
As if he was gonna practice after 2 terms as President?

Besides the question was whether truth mattered more in politics. The decision to take his law license was from some state bar, not related to some political process.

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ThomPete 3449 days ago
No that is not the point. The point is that politicians lie and always have lied also historically.
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aninhumer 3449 days ago
Yes they always lied, but they used to be punished if they were caught. The fact that it's easier to catch them now shouldn't change that.
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ThomPete 3449 days ago
No they didn't use to get punished anymore than they do today and I would urge you to find any base for that claim.

Nothing's changed.

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Chris2048 3448 days ago
> "I will close down Guantanamo Bay".

To be fair, it seems like he tried. He just failed?

He was playing it too safe to bring about the drastic measures needed to close gitmo.

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mcguire 3449 days ago
"Are Clinton and Trump the Biggest Liars Ever to Run for President? A short history of White House fabulists." By DAVID GREENBERG, http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/07/2016-donald-t...
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Chris2048 3448 days ago
> and people believe them

Or don't care. Some people in the US are so far under water, they are desperate for change; such that they'd back Trump whatever.

Sexual allegations? Who cares if he can actually tries to bring back my job...

Note, I say this without any implication of whether the allegations are true. My point is, people might not care either way. A sexual predator that fixes things is better than an someone virtuous that does nothing.

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ThomPete 3449 days ago
When did facts use to matter and for what?

The only disservice is to claim that things are somehow different when they are in fact the same.

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mcguire 3449 days ago
You see, there was this Golden Age. Everyone was beautiful, honor and virtue flourished, and Truth was held above all else.

Some people say that this age was in the '50s. Others, the 1880s. Some even claim it was the 1790s.

Mostly, they're just barking mad.

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