[moyta]

You have obviously never had to work in a unionized environment, here in Seattle Seattle Public Utilities will show union protected employees the door in a heartbeat if they cannot perform their duties or if management doesn't like them. I've seen & heard it repeatedly, here is a recent example [1]. The only people I've heard of being protected are the barely literate middle management at SPU and Oracle despite the tens of millions of dollars they have billed the city over what they quoted for a broken billing system to replace the maxed out billing system we currently have.

Get some facts & experience before commenting on things your unfamiliar with. Unionized employees nearly always vote for their interests, the number of unionized employees has collapsed under union busting tactics over the past few decades.

[1] - http://sheridanlawfirm.com/johnson-v-city-of-seattle-plainti...

[2] - http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/city-light...

[refurb]

I've worked and been a member of union and my experience was much worse.

I mean, you don't have to look any further than the big 3 automakers. I remember watching news reports of workers leaving mid-shift, going to the bar and doing cocaine. For months.

If it wasn't for the union they would have been fired years ago.

[moyta]

That is on the employer, they need to be written up if they do not perform their duties, then fired after repeated failures, just like any well run business would do.

The employee could easily sue and retain their job if there was no union and the company doesn't bother to document an employee failing to do their job.

[refurb]

I would invite you to read about some of the past issues with unions.

At the big 3 the unions practically took al firing capabilites away from the company. Unless the union agreed, the employee stayed.

And no, unless an employee has a case, they can't sue an employer to keep their job. Not unless they have the cash to keep paying lawyers.

[moyta]

> At the big 3 the unions practically took al firing capabilites away from the company. Unless the union agreed, the employee stayed.

That is 100% on the employer, if they can't be bothered to follow the firing process they have negotiated with the union, or fight for a better one, its their own damn fault. They deserve what they get and have to live with the outcomes of their actions, just like any other company or person.

> And no, unless an employee has a case, they can't sue an employer to keep their job. Not unless they have the cash to keep paying lawyers.

Sure, but you'd have a case if your employer can't be bothered to document your dereliction of your job, and employers in cases like the one I linked to often work for a cut of the judgment due to how clear cut a case like that is.