[toomanythings4]

In 1992, a friend got a job in the valley and I visited him when I was out there visiting the HQ for my company. He asked me to go with him to check out a condo he was thinking of buying. Remember that these are 1992 prices.

The two-bedroom place we looked at was just like one of my first apartments. When the agent said it was $250K, I almost fell on the floor. My wife and I had just bought our first house, which was about three times bigger as this condo with a large front and back yard in a nice middle class neighborhood, for $80K in St. Louis.

A few years ago, I saw him again. He has never owned a house but he now lives in a much nicer condo for $1.25 million. However, that condo just looks like a much nicer, updated version of that same apartment. He could have lived cheaper at an upscale, full service hotel in my town.

[lordCarbonFiber]

And the difference is you're stuck living in a "nice middle class neighborhood" with a ton of space you probably don't need. For many people moving to cities the value of the area is worth many times the value of the space.

I wouldn't trade my nyc studio for a McMansion back in bumfuck SC no matter how much you offered me; and I think there must be a large population that shares that sentiment.

[dang]

> bumfuck SC

Please don't drop slurs into HN comments. Your comment would be fine without that bit.

[lordCarbonFiber]

I could give you the name of the town I grew up in but it's not going to mean anything to a non-native resident. If you've got a better turn of phrase for a low population town not particularly near anything, nor containing anything noteworthy I'd love to hear it.

[dang]

You could have said "remote SC" or just "SC". I realize it's less colorful, but experience teaches that this is a price we must pay to have civil discussion online.

Had we been speaking in person it would likely have been obvious that you didn't mean it as a slur. But the bandwidth of online communication is so much lower that there's no capacity for such error correction even in one-to-one cases, let alone when hundreds of people are reading what you write.

[christophilus]

On the other hand, you can live in a beautiful small city like Greenville, SC in walking distance to most or all of your needs, a short drive from great Appalachian hiking, etc. for a very reasonable price. I don't think the choice is necessarily a boolean between big, expensive city life and bumfuck SC life. At least, I hope not, because I'm giving the Greenville, SC thing a try and liking it so far.

[mpbm]

I think it's more about the culture you're surrounded with. From visiting that area several time I personally know that I don't want to be immersed in that culture. There isn't necessarily anything wrong with it that couldn't be avoided, I'd just rather live around different defaults.

[randallsquared]

I work for remotely for a company in NYC and live in BFSC (Gaffney). I'm also liking it so far. And, as a bonus, my coworkers were excited to find that I live a short drive from REST Fest US, so there's that. :)

[toomuchtodo]

Any chance there really is a peach water tower in Gaffney? :D

[randallsquared]

The peachoid does indeed exist, and is as represented in popular media you may have seen on streaming services. :) They actually just repainted it.

[toomuchtodo]

Brilliant! Thank you for confirming!

[zeveb]

> I wouldn't trade my nyc studio for a McMansion back in bumfuck SC no matter how much you offered me

With an attitude like that, I certainly hope you never do: neither you nor your new South Carolinian neighbours would enjoy it.

I live in a condo now, but I miss living in a house and not being able to hear anyone but my family. I miss playing in the back yard as a kid, and roaming around the neighbourhood on long summer evenings. There are many nice things about cities, and there are many nice things about suburbs, and there are many nice things about rural areas too.

[douche]

That's really the tradeoff. Some people like trees and grass and a modicum of peace and quiet and privacy. Other people like to live in the caves of steel, with a seething mass of humanity flowing all around.

I think you can guess where I stand on the matter. You couldn't pay me enough money to relocate to Manhattan or San Francisco.

[hx87]

> Other people like to live in the caves of steel, with a seething mass of humanity flowing all around.

Funnily enough, that's what every suburban Walmart feels like.

[teamfrizz]

"I wouldn't live there if you paid me to" - The Talking Heads on suburbia.

[paulcole]

"Other people like to live in the caves of steel, with a seething mass of humanity flowing all around."

I thought you were talking about cars at first.

[willholloway]

There's a good chance that in x number of years the accumulated toll of the now near subliminal low grade stress of the city will reach a tipping point.

At the start the excitement and glamour masks the near subliminal, slow, consistent erosion of inner coherence that nyc produces in humans. But in time accumulated erosion will become evident.

Your insides will be knotted up and tightly coiled, and you won't even know it, because humans can get used to almost anything.

Your fellow denizens are experiencing it as well, and many cover and compound the feeling with excessive alcohol consumption, and status seeking.

One day a tipping point will be reached. But you will think to yourself, "but if I leave nyc, where will I go? Where else is there?"

The city is a parasitical mind virus that takes over your decision making, in order to extract rents from you.

But there is still a faint penumbra of humanity inside of you. And it will want out. But you will be scared. FOMO, and a feeling that outside the city you will be socially isolated.

Well I am here to tell you that cool small towns and cities are out there. They have enough smart and interesting people to easily fill up your Dunbar number limit.

You can only really know and relate to 150 humans, we don't need 7 million surrounding us, and online dating apps have changed the social scene in small towns and cities. There are plenty of young women (or men) around you, even in smaller towns with an older median age.

Your range will have to increase, but for that we have cars. In nyc it can easily take an hour and a half to travel five miles via public transit.

tldr; it's not binary between nyc and bumfuck suburbs, and even many small 'boring' towns have a lot more culture, singles, restaurants and bars than you would think, or at least more than I thought.

My feelings on moving back to a small town halfway between NYC and Boston as a still fairly young single are probably best expressed by the Grateful Dead in their song Shakedown Street:

"Don't tell me this town ain't got no heart. You just gotta poke around."

[Spooky23]

I haven't spent lots of time in SV, but it pretty much felt like a newer, nicer northern NJ with great weather to when I've visited. Big sea of strip malls and suburbia.

[amyjess]

Eh, I think that's more SoCal (LA/SD) than NorCal (SV). SoCal feels like a giant sprawling suburb with great weather, and NorCal is just cold, expensive, and full of hipsters.

Like, there's a very large chance I'll end up moving to SoCal if I'm ever forced to leave Texas (which might actually happen next year), but I have no desire to live in NorCal even if you paid me seven figures.

[Bahamut]

Cold? I remember at least one of the past two winters, SV was warmer than Dallas. It rarely dips below freezing.

It does get cold outside of the Bay Area, but the Bay Area is one of those special areas of California for temperature (along with San Diego).

[Spooky23]

People's version of cold varies. It's pretty funny though. I was in South Carolina in Novemebr a few years ago and people were wearing down jackets and wool hats -- it was 55!

[liveoneggs]

when did SV become a "city" comparable, in any way besides housing prices, to nyc?

[akavi]

I suspect people like LordCarbonFiber (and myself) mean SF. Which technically isn't "SV", per se, but since the discussion is about cost of living, the same argument applies.

I, at least, agree with you when it comes to SV proper. At this point in my life, I wouldn't take any amount of money to live in rural South Carolina OR San Jose.

[liveoneggs]

I think the better question is: would you live in Charleston or Atlanta or another less expensive city.

[dsfyu404ed]

Good, it keeps the prices down for those of us who want to live very far away from you.