[rayiner]

Unlike people at the dawn of civilization, those farmers didn't build those dams on the Colorado River, the Army Corps of Engineers did. As to the water agreements, they were a stupid idea that never should have happened, like lots of other stupid ideas people have had over the years (e.g. unsustainable pension agreements for public workers). The common theme is that it's essential that people today have the power to undo the mistakes of their predecessors.

Will that result in a lot of litigation? Sure. But the state has a lot of leverage on its side to push for a better result.

[me2i81]

Yeah, we have a common government that sometimes builds things, which is maybe more efficient than farmers shooting at each other over who diverted the river. Water rights are considered property, and you can't just go take them without recompense. But really, what are you after? California is going to use the collected water it has allocated for agriculture for that purpose, and the only thing you're going to accomplish by increasing what farmers pay for water is change the water usage patterns, so you'll replace a lot of alfalfa and rice with more almonds, pistachios, and wine grapes. Is that good or bad? I don't know.

[rayiner]

Sometimes the government builds things in stupid places which encourages people to do stupid things, like try to farm in the desert. And yes, water rights are property rights, but the answer simply cannot be "now you're stuck spending 80% of your water on something that makes up 2% of GDP."

There has to be a way for California's current government to fix its old mistakes. The government could tax water per gallon, or impose steep property taxes on water rights. Both would solve the problem and side-step any Constitutional takings claims by farmers.

[me2i81]

The battles over water rights have been going on in the west for at least a century, so I'm not all that optimistic that you're going to radically change how it works. But I still don't see what you're hoping to accomplish with this talk of "farming in the desert" as folly. What would you possibly do with the 30+ million acre feet that currently goes to agriculture? More golf courses?

[rayiner]

Farming in the desert is folly because that water could be put to much better uses (e.g. allowing more growth in the cities). Farming only happens in California because farmers don't pay for the real cost of that water. We don't have to do anything with that land. We have plenty of land in the U.S. Water, not so much.

[Natsu]

> Farming in the desert is folly because that water could be put to much better uses (e.g. allowing more growth in the cities).

Do we really want more growth in the cities where water is scarce?

[astrocyte]

What's your point? Let them piss all the water down the drain until there's no more? There is land in the U.S that is more hospitable to growing crops. Get your head out of your behind and see that. Otherwise, let them suck all of the water out and then look at each other like idiots when its all gone. More and more this country seems like it needs to get a smack in the face and a swift kick in the arse to wake up. I never wonder how past civilizations went extinct when I read comment trains like this. Everybody wants to talk w/ their nose up in the air instead of addressing problems... Because that's too hard and problems have been around forever. Oh no, change that makes sense. Why do that?

Reply to post below me : So, there is no issue. Best of luck.

[me2i81]

The point is that water falls from the sky, in varying amounts, every year, and California has a huge amount of infrastructure to collect and use it, and a bunch of people who manage it. If agriculture and ranching stopped in California there would be nothing to do with 2/3s of that water (i.e. about twice annual domestic/commercial use), even in drought years, once the reservoirs and aquifers filled up again. It would end up in the ocean. If the western mega-drought that some people are talking about happens, then things would be different.

[rayiner]

A sustainable solution wouldn't involve ending all farming in California. Instead, what you would do is set a tax per gallon that's high enough so that demand for water decreases to the sustainable level of supply. That'll drive a lot of farmers out of business, but that's okay, that's what welfare is for. But some farmers will be able to stay in business because their crops are valuable enough to be worth growing in the desert.