[omniverse]

Postponing something like this that would boost the prosperity of both continents is highly irresponsible. Majority of the public can only grasp emotional catchphrases and isn't nearly cognitively capable of grasping the enormous benefits of this important agreement. This is incredibly frustrating, it should have been signed 50 years ago.

[anonyfox]

I don't see any benefit for EU countries here. Also, as long as the papers aren't fully opened for the public, signing them would render our "democracy" here a joke. It's just not acceptable.

Basically this whole thing exists solely to strengthen the power of huge US companies against these "nasty" EU regulations. No thanks, deregulation isn't something we want here.

Even if everything here falls apart regarding connections to the US we would still be humming along just fine in the EU.

[__m]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UsHHOCH4q8

[omniverse]

EU is much poorer than US due to its socialist policies and if you oppose this agreement you wish to rob others EU citizens of prosperity, you should re-examine your tyrannical stance.

US companies run circles around EU companies because US has a freer business environment, although both could learn a lot from Singapore even more.

[anonyfox]

Poor? Measuring what? Yes, the US is much more liberal and stuff, but know what? We have way lower crime rates, much less citizens in prison, good healthcare and education systems for everyone, and average people don't have to work in 3 jobs in parallel to earn a living. And tell me, a german, about how rich the US is, comparing the national dept? Isn't it that China virtually owns a large chunk of the US already due to credits and bonds?

Yes, the top 1% in the US have much more money than the top 1% in EU, but that's it. Oh my god, we also have less startups with boatloads of funding that develop the next big social messenger thingy, or mobile app for optimizing "how to burn through VC". Woo!

Seriously, you lost me with "socialist policies". This is complete bullshit. You have to strike a balance between business greediness and general welfare.

[kolme]

There's many people here in the EU who are strongly opposed (myself, for example).

We don't want this "prosperity" if they're going to undo many regulations we have in place for our safety. Food-industry regulations, plastic/chemicals regulations.

Thanks, but no thanks. Deregulating is not as cool as "liberal" guys tell us.

[almavi]

Not to mention the new 'Private Justice' they want to set up in order to benefit corporations.

[omniverse]

This private justice would ensure that the free market reigns, not the misguided whims of bureaucrats who like to make tyrannical regulatory laws in their quest for more political power.

[anonyfox]

Actually, the "free market" is an illusion that never works in reality, as much as communism is an utopia.

Given actually complete freedom, companies would cartelize to monopolies and suppress any competition or innovation, so they would have a status quo, could dictate the prices, buy the political system to prevent any change that could harm them and finally squeeze as much profit as possible out of everyone so that the rich people can get even richer while the poor ones (99%) suffer without any chance tho change something. Free market stories are used to have a carrot on a stick in front of people so they don't complain too much, and "influenced" mass media surpasses the free will of most people.

Our "misguided whims of bureaucrats" seem to regulate too much, but the reality is that there is just way too much bullshit out there. Regulation leads to standardization and everyone benefits after a short period of moaning.

[omniverse]

Those EU regulations are not bad, but that's no need to discard the entire agreement, there is so much more at stake, it is ridiculous to be so small minded.

[anonyfox]

Open the entire agreement up to the public and we can discuss these magical benefits for everyone that all the clever people here seem to miss out.

[josteink]

> Profile created: 1 day ago

So it has come to this. TTP and TTIP has become so poisonous that its dirty lobby are now sending paid shills to create accounts on social networking and news sites and post fake support.

That's terrible and excellent news at the same time. It's terrible because I don't want those shills here. It's excellent because it means we're winning.

[Karunamon]

Calling people shills just because they disagree with you is both a shitty thing to do, and also directly against the rules.

[omniverse]

Either that or hacker news does not afford freedom of speech and shadow bans accounts that post anything contrary to the socialist dogma. Your conspiracy theories are cute.

[anonyfox]

You watched too much fox news I'd say.

[aroberge]

Really? Can you explain why? Everything I've read, including emails obtained through FOIA points out to increasing rights for corporations at the expense of rights of individuals and weakening of protection for populations on the environment front. So why should it be signed?

[omniverse]

More trade = more economic growth = stronger and richer US and EU. I am not terribly interested in whatever excuses the environmental extremists have come up with this time.

[dmoo]

>stronger and richer US and EU.

The EU is a political construct yet you promote the benefits of a stronger EU while deriding the political system.

>This private justice would ensure that the free market reigns, not the misguided whims of bureaucrats who like to make tyrannical regulatory laws in their quest for more political power.

[gpvos]

All the people I know who are against it are pretty smart. Apparently the decision makers are doing a bad job of explaining the benefits of this to us. Which is sad, because we are their employers.

[ionised]

And what are the benefits?