[zastavka]

I think caveat emptor absolutely applies with bootcamps, but there are also ones that are certainly worth the money. I'm a recent App Academy grad (full disclosure) and almost all of my cohort are now at high-paying jobs at companies they love, including Google, Groupon and Tumblr. (I'm still looking for work right now, but only because of extenuating personal circumstances.)

Having talked with my friends who are working now, there are definitely things a/A doesn't teach you much about (e.g. deployment/devops, advanced Git) but on the whole we all feel like we learned more than enough to prepare ourselves for working in software development. I've heard very good things about Hack Reactor as well, though they expect you to come in with some coding experience already.

So yes, there are good/great ones out there, but I'd agree that your bullshit detector should be set very high if you're looking into bootcamps.

[hikz]

  I've heard very good things about Hack Reactor as well

My first impression of them is dishonesty.

They claim to be "The CS degree for the 21st century" which is simply not true for an intensive web development course.

[zastavka]

While it's maybe a bit of an exaggeration, good bootcamps have an emphasis on (ahem) marketable skills that a lot of CS programs don't. You'd be right that you don't learn a ton of theory like you would in CS, but App Academy at least (and I'd assume Hack Reactor as well) makes sure you have enough grounding in programming fundamentals that learning new languages/frameworks/stacks isn't hard.

That said, one weird thing I've heard about Hack Reactor is that they purposely will hold back students they feel aren't 100% where they want them to be and keep them from graduating. Whether that's out of genuine concern for students or it's just to inflate their job placement numbers (or both), I couldn't tell you.

[eastbayjake]

> That said, one weird thing I've heard about Hack Reactor is that they purposely will hold back students they feel aren't 100% where they want them to be and keep them from graduating.

2013 Hack Reactor grad here. I had actually heard this about Dev Bootcamp before applying to HR, so I asked the HR founders during my interviews if they did this and they emphatically said no. Their genuine emphasis on supporting students -- including intensive interventions when they detect students might be falling behind -- was the main reason I decided to fork over $17k to a couple of strangers and move across the country to San Francisco.

And they didn't disappoint me. Our cohort of 26 had two drop-outs: one guy on the second day (he was from Atlanta, felt a little out of place and wanted to go home, so he became the first person to take HR up on their "full refund if for any reason you want to quit during the first week" offer) and a girl almost midway through the course (she got intensive support, we were all really rallying for her, but she didn't want to keep going). Everyone else pulled together, worked long hours, built some incredible projects, and landed jobs at lots of Companies You've Heard Of. But don't take my word for it... check out the [Hack Reactor alumni page](http://www.hackreactor.com/students/) and see for yourself.

I don't know a single student who has been held back, although I graduated nearly two years ago and my experience may be outdated.

[zastavka]

> 2013 Hack Reactor grad here. I had actually heard this about Dev Bootcamp before applying to HR, so I asked the HR founders during my interviews if they did this and they emphatically said no.

Huh, interesting. I knew DBC does that too but they seemed much more upfront about it in their ad copy (and in fact it was touted as a selling point). FWIW, a/A sounds similar to HR by how you describe it; they want everyone to succeed and will give you plenty of support but if you still aren't pulling your weight you'll get booted. There was a guy in our cohort who dropped right before final projects and they let him come back at the same point in the next cycle but they made an exception for him because he had personal reasons for dropping.

But yeah, besides that, great learning environment, everyone wants everyone else to do well, build cool shit and get good jobs. I'd recommend a/A in a heartbeat to anyone, with the caveat that you've done enough programming to know it's something you enjoy doing. (But the amount of Ruby you have to learn to get through the admission process successfully is a pretty decent litmus test.)

[eastbayjake]

Someone was just complaining to me that a/A requires a $14k deposit up front, even though the marketing says it's "no cost until you find a job". (In which case it's more like "full refund if you don't find a job" not "no cost until you find a job".) Is there any truth to that?

[zastavka]

$14k? Not unless they changed it since I enrolled. I did have to pay a deposit but it was "only" $5k. I admit I was annoyed because they had just bumped that number from $3750 IIRC. So you do have to front some cash but nothing approaching the full eventual cost of the program. (Again, unless they changed it, which would make me a bit sad if they did. I like that lowered-risk, alignment-of-incentives model and it would be a shame if they had to abandon it.)

[better_no_name]

I went through Hack Reactor. It's not a CS degree, but I work next to people having one. I don't think they're necessarily better at their job. "The CS degree for the 21st century" can mean anything. It's just marketing bullshit. That being said, judging startups (and IMO Hack Reactor is essentially a startup) based on their marketing would mean that 90% of startups are - what you call - "dishonest".

I enjoyed HR, I'm valuable for the company I'm working for, I maintain a couple of successful Open Source projects (~ 500 stars each) in Go, JavaScript and Haskell.

Without being too arrogant, most CS graduates can barely code. And realistically that's what most of us either do or should do all day long.