[TeMPOraL]

I think that people are ignorant, because why wouldn't they be? They have zero individual influence, 99% of things the government talks about openly is irrelevant bullshit and part of shaping the voter's sympathy. So basically if it doesn't influence your daily life and you have zero control over it, why should you care?

So it doesn't seem surprising at all that people in modern democracies are ignorant of most of the politics. I think that many in tech, who are acutely aware of the significance of the NSA affair, care about it not because of politics, but because it's wrong and hurts people.

[xiaq]

> So basically if it doesn't influence your daily life and you have zero control over it, why should you care?

I cannot really argue against this pessimistic picture of democracy.

> I think that many in tech, who are acutely aware of the significance of the NSA affair, care about it not because of politics, but because it's wrong and hurts people.

Your definition of politics is very weird to me. Since preventing wrong things that happen on a big scale fits perfectly into my definition of political activities (think about the American civil rights movement).

[TeMPOraL]

>> So basically if it doesn't influence your daily life and you have zero control over it, why should you care?

> I cannot really argue against this pessimistic picture of democracy.

I on the other hand don't see a different way. It seems to me that if you really want to change something for the better, you need to steer clear of any kind of politics. It's like a swamp or quicksand; if you enter it, you'll get stuck there.

> Your definition of politics is very weird to me. Since preventing wrong things that happen on a big scale fits perfectly into my definition of political activities (think about the American civil rights movement).

My working definition of politics here is anything that involves politicians and especially political parties, because anything they touch immediately gets corrupted and turned into a way for said officials to safeguard their careers. You may say I'm cynical, but that's what I see all around, living in a democracy. I admit there may be a better word than "politics" for what I'm talking about, but I can't find it now.

[XorNot]

People who claim they want to "avoid politics" tend to create the most toxic political situations around them. You "avoid politics" by generally becoming a despot.

[extra88]

What you call politics I might call partisanship to differentiate it from a broader sense of politics.

[balabaster]

There also may be a better word than "democracy" for what you're talking about ;)

[tripzilch]

"Deadlocked two-party rule with <that particular US election system where it sometimes hardly matters what you vote just because of where you live>"

You know how, if you question people about democracy enough, after a bit they'll usually admit that "okay it's not optimal, but it's the best we got / came up with so far".

That means you can fuck it up. It means you can do democracy badly. It means that just because it is technically a "democracy", doesn't mean it's working properly.

[nfoz]

The claim was about political ignorance of common people in the US. You extended that to "people in modern democracies". I think this is incorrect.

In Canada, I find people are typically more politically aware if not involved, as compared to the US where I live now.