[kabdib]

Add to this list the Secret Service for financial fraud related things (as well as protecting government officials), including credit card fraud, phone fraud (at least in the 80s), and the odd whatever-the-hell-we-feel-like-doing fear-based thing (e.g., Steve Jackson Games).

Rule of thumb: If something contains the word 'Cyber' in it, it's gonna be clueless, bureaucratic and political, and utterly incompetently done.

[drzaiusapelord]

>Rule of thumb: If something contains the word 'Cyber' in it, it's gonna be clueless, bureaucratic and political, and utterly incompetently done.

Yet somehow Chinese and Russian cyberwar programs are pretty effective. Sounds like the US needs to catch up.

[bediger4000]

Yet somehow Chinese and Russian cyberwar programs are pretty effective.

1. That vaunted "effectiveness" may be Just Another Missile Gap, i.e. a realistically non-existent threat used to drum up fear in the USA, to get greater funding from a terrorized public.

2. Lots of analysts say that both China and Russia tolerate unofficial hacking/cyberwar groups, as long as the targets are outside of China and Russia respectively. With some small amount of guidance done surreptitiously, the governments take advantage of a huge number of semi-criminals to serve "national security" needs without attribution.

3. Because of (2), ISO-9001, CMM level N don't apply. Faster coding. Similarly, Script Kiddies, Honkers and Nationalist Hackers don't do clearances, much less compartmentalized projects (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Security_clearance#Compartmente...) - this means that more people are available, from very diverse backgrounds, and they can collaborate and communicate as necessary.

Unless the USA is willing to quit being bureaucratic to the point of paralysis, it will never catch up.