[ksk]

The reason people complain is because iOS updates are a horrible kind of bait and switch. You update the OS because you think its awesome, but are unable to downgrade when you find that in reality, its slow and bloated.

The most infuriating thing in all of this is that my iPhone 4S is STILL a fast device. The CPU hasn't shrunk since the time I bought it. Apple has decided that I am unworthy of restoring my phone to the state it was when I purchased it.

[poopchute]

Wont a factory reset bring it back to iOS 5 or whatever it shipped with?

[duskwuff]

No. Doing a restore on an iOS device will always update it to the most recent version of iOS, not the one it shipped with.

[bdcravens]

It'll update it to the version you've installed, that is. In recent months I've restored and sold 2 iPhone4, one with ios7, one with ios6.

[Mikeb85]

Yup. I had 1 iPhone, my first and last Apple product.

My mom just got an iPad mini, was infuriated when she discovered she can't buy Kindle books from the Kindle app like she could on Android.

The artificial restrictions Apple places on developers and users are ridiculous. And Android 5 is the first release where I can say that Android is unequivocally a nicer experience than iOS...

[ljf]

Just so you know, you can't buy kindle books from the Android app anymore either - main reason I use Aldiko to read epub now.

Agreed about Android 5 though, best yet!

[fpgeek]

Say what now? I just opened my Kindle app and the store hasn't gone anywhere.

Are you maybe thinking of Google blocking Amazon from including the Amazon Appstore in the Amazon shopping app? That's a different issue and, more importantly, that doesn't really affect what's possible on Android, just how convenient it is. After all, anyone who wants to can download the store Google blocked from Amazon directly.

[madeofpalk]

Just like how if anyone wants to purchase a Kindle book on the iPad, they can do it via Safari (they could make it more convenient by pinning it to the home screen as well)

[bookwormAT]

Actually, no. Being able to purchase a book over a web browser and installing a native application store on your device are very different things.

I think you can argue that a browser itself is an app store (you download and execute (web-)apps with it). But Apple does not allow the installation of different browser engines, so you can still not install an app store on your device.

[Mikeb85]

To my mom, it comes down to this:

She has an Android phone, with which she can buy books through the Kindle app (without messing with a website).

She has an iPad, on which she can't buy books through the Kindle app, and she does have to go through a browser to their website.

To her, the Android experience is better because of this (she reads a lot).

[madeofpalk]

I understand what you're saying, technically they are different things.

But not to my mother.

I would guess (and only guess, I haven't tried to look for any numbers) that the percentage of people who go out and install an alternative app store, let alone Amazon's, is quite small (especially once you take out the HN audience)

[Bud]

Most of the criticisms of brand-new OS updates being "slow and bloated" are from extremely impatient users (or professional clickbait critics) who don't even have the good sense to wait a few hours or a day or two for the processes that can make major upgrades a bit sluggish on ALL devices to complete, such as rebuilding databases, the fact that OS updates often result in dozens or even hundreds of app updates that have to download and install and in some cases update their own databases, etc.

Certainly, they do not wait for the first x.0.1 release, or for the release that usually closely follows the initial release and which is specifically intended to optimize performance on the oldest devices that can still support the latest OS. This was seen for iOS 7 and once again for iOS 8.

I don't think it's a valid comment, or a comment made in good faith, to say that iOS updates are a "bait and switch". That's just silliness and flies in the face of all the facts. The facts say, very loudly, that Apple supports its older devices MUCH better and for much longer than any competitor. It's not even close.

Now, if you are unable to acknowledge reality, and expect that a brand-new OS, designed to take advantage of devices that are about 10x as fast as three-year-old or four-year-old devices, isn't going to be quite as snappy on older devices, then in my opinion, that is on you as a user. Blaming Apple for trying to give more features to users on new hardware is ludicrous. Apple expends considerable engineering effort keeping those devices working as well as possible. The iPhone has been out for seven years. There's now more than enough history out there for users to know that if you install major iOS updates, you cannot easily downgrade. (It's not impossible, it's just a huge pain.)

[sambe]

I'm sorry but this is simply untrue. Every time I have hardware 1-1.5 generations behind (which is not always, I've done it both ways) the OS upgrade makes it somewhere between noticeably slower and painfully slow. I've recently used an identical model side-by-side that was not upgraded and it is vastly snappier. this has nothing to do with waiting for x.0.1 or app updates. In this case we are talking about iOS 7 on 4S, I'm refusing the iOS 8 upgrade for obvious reasons. I've seen others have similar problems in previous iterations whilst my newer hardware was fine.

People are fond of overstating Apple problems and I'm grateful that the opportunity to upgrade exists at all. However it is a fact that it often destroys the performance so the ability to revert seems very reasonable. I also find the extent of the degradation puzzling.

[ksk]

>There's now more than enough history out there for users to know that if you install major iOS updates, you cannot easily downgrade.

Certainly, that is your version of reality. Only a small minority of users have any clue about downgrading.

>I don't think it's a valid comment, or a comment made in good faith, to say that iOS updates are a "bait and switch".

>that Apple supports its older devices MUCH better and for much longer than any competitor.

Well, it depends on your viewpoint. How can you 'support' a device by incrementally making it slower with each passing release? If all they were releasing was bug fixes and patches, and features which didn't adversely impact performance then YES I would agree with you. Or hell, I'd even agree with you with the current situation if Apple allowed downgrades.

Seriously, I mean don't you think its totally messed up that Apple has to give its permission before you're able to downgrade the OS to speed it up when its their own update that slowed it down ? Its ridiculous and should not be accepted as the norm.

> you cannot easily downgrade. (It's not impossible, it's just a huge pain.)

Cool, please point the entire world to a working bootrom exploit for the 4s. We've been waiting for a while :)

[rahimnathwani]

My iPhone 5 is <2 years old. Since the update to iOS8 (and even now, running 8.1.2):

- the UI crashes several times per day, rendering the phone unusable for 20-40 seconds

- the phone is really sluggish, sometimes freezing for 5-10 seconds, with keystrokes entered during that time sometimes buffered and sometimes lost

- every couple of days, the phone freezes so badly I have to force it to reboot by holding power+home for a few seconds

[mbesto]

> The facts say, very loudly, that Apple supports its older devices MUCH better and for much longer than any competitor. It's not even close.

Which facts? These? http://arstechnica.com/apple/2014/09/ios-8-on-the-iphone-4s-...

[LunaSea]

With updates like Yosemite you now get a almost daily crash thanks to Apple.

Maverick was perfectly fine.

[tluyben2]

On old hardware right? No crashes so far here on a new air.

[LunaSea]

Nope MBP is one year old.