[yottah]

"Public interest" is mostly an excuse for unnecessary statism and senseless regulation of European bureaucrats. European economy is very weak compared to that of US, and proponents of regulations under the guise of "public interest" have zero legitimacy because the results are terrible.

Allowing corporations to free themselves from the shackles of regulation will benefit average citizen of both continents by increasing prosperity and choice. European economy has barely grown for 15 years and these agreements are a welcome development.

[leccine]

"European economy has barely grown for 15 years and these agreements are a welcome development."

Good, keep it this way. We don't need more economic growth because the 90% of it goes straight to billionaires and the average worker don't benefit from it anyways. What we really need is an economy that does not rely on growth and mass production of toxic waste.

[ohitsdom]

Are you arguing the benefits of a stagnant economy? I don't understand how that could be a good thing. The economy needs to at least match growth of the population, or else that means you have unemployment or lower wages. But if that's what you want just to stick it to the billionaires...

[PythonicAlpha]

Growth and more growth is only needed, because of our interest based money system.

Any gardener can tell you, that unlimited (and exponential) growth is not possible. But economists still believe in it.

Some (very soon) day, all the resources of this planet will be wasted -- and humanity will have destroyed itself -- just because of economic theories and to make billionaires from millionaires.

[avz]

Growth is needed to lift people out of poverty, create jobs and opportunities and support wider range of social projects from infrastructure to space exploration.

The burden we're putting on the resources of this planet is indeed very high and we must work to reduce it. However, GDP growth with shrinking burden on the environment is achievable by generating more value on a smaller environmental footprint (see my other comment, in short: we can increase GDP by growing the relative aggregate value of services, software and products made of recycled materials).

[PythonicAlpha]

That is just capitalistic propaganda that now runs the last decades over the world.

But it does not work any more. The "growth" of the last two decades did go 99% into the pockets of the millionaires and billionaires.

Today is the situation, that new jobs in underdeveloped countries are at the existence minimum of that country or below -- meaning, those people work their ass of, just to survive and make the big bosses richer. And additionally, the environments of the countries are polluted, resources are depleted ...

All in the name of god money.

[briandh]

> But it does not work any more. The "growth" of the last two decades did go 99% into the pockets of the millionaires and billionaires.

According to the world bank, the number of people in poverty worldwide declined from about 1.9 billion in 1990 to about 1.2 billion in 2010. That is despite an increase in surveyed population of about 1.4 billion over the same period. ( http://iresearch.worldbank.org/PovcalNet/index.htm?1,0 )

Now, it is possible that economic growth over that period was so enormous that only 1% of it (or less, considering that there are more people in the world besides the very destitute, millionaires, and billionaires) was sufficient for that amazing reduction in poverty.

But it seems unlikely, so I would appreciate a source for the assertion "The 'growth' of the last two decades did go 99% into the pockets of the millionaires and billionaires."

[leccine]

I am arguing that for an average person there is no difference between 3% growth and 15% growth, but for mother Earth there is and I don't care about corporate CEOs (less than 1% of the global population) and the Rokafela bros. Sorry for my ignorance but I think an average person and our planet is more important than few fat bankers and their CEO friends. I know, I am a bad person.

[avz]

Economic growth does not necessarily imply destruction of the environment. The growth rate refers to the rate at which value of products and services in an economy grows. The aggregate environmental footprint may in fact shrink or grow slower than the GDP. I can think of three reasons why there could be a gap between GDP growth and environmental footprint growth:

Services. Most of the value in a modern economy lies in services whose footprint is a lot lower than manufacturing.

Software. Even in manufacturing increasing part of the value comes from non-material components like software and network services.

Recycling. Recycling and downcycling lower environmental footprint by reducing our need for raw materials.

[PythonicAlpha]

That is just a theory. What do we have in practice:

- Some years ago, you could (yourself) exchange the battery of your mobile phone -- today, many mobile phones will be thrown away, when the battery is finished or any other part does not work any more. Todays "highest tech" industries are environmental nightmares. And now they even build tablet PCs that way, that should replace normal computers (see MS Surface).

- A lot more products are just build for fast consumption and recycling is still not in focus of most manufacturers. Instead, the waste from Europe is exported to Africa.

What I say: I am sure, that it would be possible, but with our todays ideology of growth for the sake of more and more profits and less and less regulation, that is just not "compatible".

[sirkneeland]

It's actually more likely that your battery will be properly disposed of today than it was a decade ago. Its being integrated into the phone means it is handled in the entire "decommissioning" of the phone (when you recycle it, trade it in or even throw it away where it is fished out by garbage processing companies who make money by salvaging electronics out of garbage and preventing it from going to landfills.

[yottah]

You are welcome to move to Venezuela, Belarus or some other unlivable place. I'd prefer Europe to be economically free and in growing prosperity much like Singapore. Sadly most of EU citizens are overly brainwashed with statist propaganda from birth, and promoting degenerate policies which cause economic weakness.

[anigbrowl]

Crony capitalism is bad, and so is Marxist claptrap.

[snowwrestler]

Yes, youth unemployment riots in Paris are great; let's keep things just the way they are.