[joshstrange]

I have almost no problem with internal recruiters, it's the external/contingency recruiters that I hate with a fiery passion. They call during work hours, email constantly, and provide VERY little value in my experience.

As others have mentioned, due to the high payouts to these recruiters they are willing to lie their pants off to get you to accept the job. The last recruiter I worked with tried to hide the name of the company which really irked me. I am not some piece of cattle to be herded between companies and I am perfectly capable of looking up information on a company to determine if I want to work there or not.

I don't need a recruiter throwing buzzwords at me that he/she thinks will convince me to take the job. Every call with the recruiter was more painful than the last and then at one point the recruiters supervisor contacted me and used even more BS/flowery language to try and convince me to apply for the job.

A few months after I got a new job (without a recruiter) I was contacted by another recruiter but noticed before I trashed the email that this wasn't from a company of recruiters. Instead it was a recruiter hired by the company looking for programmers. We talked back and forth on email a little and she was very nice and I felt like there was much less over-hyping (still a little but that's to be expected in that position). Within a few days and about 2-3 emails I had a phone call with the co-founder. I ended up not taking the job due to lack of experience in what they were really looking for but it was a very pleasant experience. Contrast that with 5+ calls (3 during work before I told him not to call 9-5) with the external recruiter, a meeting in person, him harassing my reference, and never once being able to talk to anyone at the company they were trying to hire me for.

[fecak]

Your experience with internal recruiters vs external is not unique, and it's the recruiting model that is at fault. Internal recruiters aren't going to be too salesy - they have a monopoly (not always) on the job requirements at their company, and they aren't being paid commission - whether you take the job or not may impact a bonus or performance review, but it isn't going to get them a car.

The contingency recruiter, particularly one who is independent and not working for a big firm, wants you to take the job because it means a new car.

This is an important thing to understand. Cashiers at grocery stores don't pressure you into buying more items, because what you buy has no discernible impact on them. Car salesmen, or realtors, care quite a bit.

Until companies start changing the way they engage recruiters things won't change. Paying them less, but with some guaranteed up front money, is my answer.

[drdeadringer]

> They call during work hours

Honest question: Should recruiters call during non-work hours when -- presumably -- no one would answer?

Side note: I prefer email, and it is mysterious to me why a significant portion of recruiters simply must insist on a telephone conversation when an email would suffice.

[joshstrange]

I also would prefer an email as long as it's is not some form letter (which is all I get from external recruiters and is nothing like what I received from the internal recruiter). I'd also like them to take a look at my github, google me, know more about me than "joshstrange.isProgrammer == true".

The internal recruiter talked only over email with me and setup a call with the cofounder in her second email to me. (Note: we traded a few more emails to figure out a time that worked for both of us). I just looked at the first email she sent and it isn't very personalized but it is informal and not a wall of text filled with BS buzzwords.

-------------------------------------- Hi Josh,

I work for [removed]. We're kind of like a [removed] for [removed]. We’re [removed], whether they work in factories, wait tables, or drive firetrucks, with each other and the companies they work for. We recently raised our Series B round and we’re looking for great engineers to help us reach an even bigger audience.

We are passionate about including all employees at the workplace in the conversation. Potentially you could be a great fit for our engineering team here at [removed]. Would you be open to chat either today or tomorrow?

Look forward to connecting with you.

Best, [removed] --------------------------------------

As you can see they didn't mention anything specific to me but I am much more open to responding to than what I get from most recruiters.

I may be an edge case in the phone call department but I always answer my phone if I am awake and not in the middle of something with friends. If I am at home at 8pm messing around online or watching TV I will answer. I find it extremely uncomfortable to talk with a recruiter while at work. It was even worse at my last job where I sat within 5 feet from my boss with no divider between us at all. I feel like I have to speak in code and watch out from saying certain words that might tip off my current employer that I am talking to a recruiter. Now a days if I hear the words "Hi I'm XXX XXX with YYYYY" I hangup if "YYYYY" is a recruiting firm. If you google my name you can find my email address in seconds so there is no reason anyone should have to call me and I refuse to deal with external recruiting companies after multiple bad experiences and overall dislike of their business model.

[bcbrown]

>Every call with the recruiter was more painful than the last

Why did you continue to work with that recruiter after the first call?